A few random questions

[chrisa]

Hello all -
I'm a fairly new manual driver, having picked up a 2003 Saab 9-5 Aero last summer and enjoying every minute spent driving it.

Anyway, some questions that I have:

-If I'm not careful, reverse gear is hard to engage and grinds. Disengaging the clutch, putting the car in fourth gear until coming to a full stop, then letting off the brake and going into reverse has worked well for me.
Just wondering what I should be doing to avoid this, and what the cause of this issue is. With 150k miles, I'm not surprised that it isn't perfect.

-It seems hard to shift smoothly when the gearbox is cold, especially with the nearly single-digit temperatures we've been getting recently. The gear stick moves OK, but the car jerks more when engaging the clutch (foot off the pedal), like if I let it out too quickly. After a few minutes of driving, that goes away. Is this normal?

-Does it matter if I leave the car in gear while starting or should it be in neutral? In this car, reverse must be selected for the key to come out, so I usually leave it there and once the car fires up, I can choose first if needed.

-Any thoughts on replacing the transmission fluid? I'm not planning on it but given that the former owners seemed to skimp on maintenance, I wouldn't be surprised if it's never been changed. Also wondering if it would provide any benefits like smoother shifting, etc.

Thanks guys, that's all for now.

[AHTOXA]

Hello all -
I'm a fairly new manual driver, having picked up a 2003 Saab 9-5 Aero last summer and enjoying every minute spent driving it.

Anyway, some questions that I have:

-If I'm not careful, reverse gear is hard to engage and grinds. Disengaging the clutch, putting the car in fourth gear until coming to a full stop, then letting off the brake and going into reverse has worked well for me.
Just wondering what I should be doing to avoid this, and what the cause of this issue is. With 150k miles, I'm not surprised that it isn't perfect.

Are you completely stopped before engaging reverse? Once you're stopped, give it 1-2 seconds and then engage. If this does not resolve your issue, then stop, put in any gear and then go into reverse.

-It seems hard to shift smoothly when the gearbox is cold, especially with the nearly single-digit temperatures we've been getting recently. The gear stick moves OK, but the car jerks more when engaging the clutch (foot off the pedal), like if I let it out too quickly. After a few minutes of driving, that goes away. Is this normal?

That's normal, especially with such low temps that you describe.

-Does it matter if I leave the car in gear while starting or should it be in neutral? In this car, reverse must be selected for the key to come out, so I usually leave it there and once the car fires up, I can choose first if needed.

It doesn't matter which gear the shifter is in, as long as the clutch is down.

-Any thoughts on replacing the transmission fluid? I'm not planning on it but given that the former owners seemed to skimp on maintenance, I wouldn't be surprised if it's never been changed. Also wondering if it would provide any benefits like smoother shifting, etc.

I would plan on changing the trans oil, if I were you, especially since you say that maintenance prior may be questionable. There are great oils like Redline MT90 that will improve durability of the gearbox and improve shifting in all conditions.

Thanks guys, that's all for now.

Welcome aboard!

[tankinbeans]

Welcome into the fold.

[chrisa]

Thanks! I've certainly learned a lot reading this board and enjoy it.

[kamesama980]

Reverse will do that, most transmissions don't use synchronizers in reverse and do use sliding straight cut gears. If any of the gears or shafts are still moving, even from inertia, it'll make noise. There are a few transmissions that DO use synchros in reverse. I've never looked in to how it works or which ones (I know the T56 does as well as the 5 speed in early Infinity G20s) have it. As long as you aren't putting it in reverse while moving forward or trying to force it making sustained horrible noises, you probably won't hurt it.

As for starting in gear with the clutch pushed...technically proper way is to have it in neutral AND clutch pushed in JUST IN CASE the clutch actuator isn't working and the clutch isn't disengaged. I've read one or two cases on forums of clutch hydraulics going out or even just being weak and the car/truck jerking when started because the clutch wasn't fully disengaged. Millions of people get by starting the car with a gear selected. I put it in neutral just the same. I figure get in the habit because the time it fails will be the time I'm parked in front of some ridiculously expensive car.

I'd change the fluid. It's cheap enough in the long run considering it might run another 30, 60, even 100k miles. Do some research on the saab forums for what people like to use. sometimes it's what the owners manual says, sometimes it's something else. For the firebird's T56, the consensus is plain-jane dexron that the manual says works great. for the toyota auto that was in the cressy, toyota T-IV works way better even though it's technically not compatible with the dex II specified for the car.

[MidnightDrive94]

Something that's always worked for me in the past whenever the gearbox doesn't seem to wanna get into reverse is putting the car back into neutral, releasing the clutch, and then pressing the clutch again and once again attempt to put the car into reverse.

[potownrob]

-If I'm not careful, reverse gear is hard to engage and grinds. Disengaging the clutch, putting the car in fourth gear until coming to a full stop, then letting off the brake and going into reverse has worked well for me.
Just wondering what I should be doing to avoid this, and what the cause of this issue is. With 150k miles, I'm not surprised that it isn't perfect.

what worked for me (if i remember right) was to let the tranny run in neutral with the clutch out (disengaged) right before clutching into reverse (rather than holding in the clutch forever then trying to move the shifter into reverse). you may have to hold the clutch in for a couple of seconds before going into reverse.
EDIT: I now remember I sometimes also would shift into a forward gear and then into reverse. Some cars are more finnicky than others. My 94 Civic's tranny taught me to do that trick. I also often had to shift into 2nd before going into 1st. It's better for the tranny (but not as easy to physically do) to shift into 3rd then 1st, since you wear the synchros on the gear you're shifting to and 2nd gear's synchros are more crucial than 3rds in most trannies (from what i've read at least).

-It seems hard to shift smoothly when the gearbox is cold, especially with the nearly single-digit temperatures we've been getting recently. The gear stick moves OK, but the car jerks more when engaging the clutch (foot off the pedal), like if I let it out too quickly. After a few minutes of driving, that goes away. Is this normal?

sounds normal

-Does it matter if I leave the car in gear while starting or should it be in neutral? In this car, reverse must be selected for the key to come out, so I usually leave it there and once the car fires up, I can choose first if needed.

i'd start the car in neutral, and let the clutch out if you're going to sit there for more than a few seconds before moving off.

-Any thoughts on replacing the transmission fluid? I'm not planning on it but given that the former owners seemed to skimp on maintenance, I wouldn't be surprised if it's never been changed. Also wondering if it would provide any benefits like smoother shifting, etc.

i would definitely change it if you don't know when it was last changed, let alone how the car was driven. don't believe the hype about manual transmissions lasting forever without a single gear oil change; not worth the risk, and yes, the tranny will shift smoother with fresh lube/oil as long as it's compatible with your tranny. search forums specific to your car for recommended brands for your tranny.

[tankinbeans]

To piggyback off of Rob, make sure you ask for gear grease. The auto parts gutta around here routinely recommend automatic transmission fluid, even after being told multiple times that the vehicle in question is a manual. I think my brother's Corolla called for 75W-90.

[theholycow]

To piggyback off of Rob, make sure you ask for gear grease. The auto parts gutta around here routinely recommend automatic transmission fluid, even after being told multiple times that the vehicle in question is a manual. I think my brother's Corolla called for 75W-90.

It's gear oil, not gear grease. Some manual transmissions specify gear oil, some (as odd as it sounds) specify automatic transmission fluid. I know there's at least one Honda gearbox that specifies engine oil, even.

Also, just FYI and not really important to the discussion, the scale for viscosity ratings is different. See this post:

So I was doing more research on this topic. Apparently gear oil viscosity is much much different then normal motor oil.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gear_oil
API viscosity ratings for gear oils are not directly comparable with those for motor oil, and they are thinner than the figures suggest. For example, many modern gearboxes use a 75W90 gear oil, which is actually of equivalent viscosity to a 10W40 motor oil.

I always find that interesting. Why did they do that? Why didn't they make the scale the same?

[tankinbeans]

It's gear oil, not gear grease.

Whoops. My mistake. I've had bad experiences where I've mentioned that I need gear oil, only to have the dude behind the counter come out with ATF. Then I go to check the manual and it specifies gear oil or whatever.

[ClutchFork]

AHTOXA's responses are good. I didn't read all the others, but surely much good advice. I would only add that the hard shifting when cold is likely the tranny lube. I would get a high end synthetic. You can search out the proper manual tranny fluid for your car on http://www.redlineoil.com. Redline has better cold flow properties because it is synthetic and should improve cold shifting, also Redline will have better anti wear properties and will last a long time. Redline is way better than most off the shelf synthetics. You could also try Amsoil's best manual tranny fluid I think Signature Series.

Also what state do you live in? Alaska would be much different than say Texas for cold operation.

I just ran your car though Redine's applicaiton guide and it says you woudl take their
MTL 70W80 GL-4 quart (MTL=Manual Transmission Lube.) That is what I run in my Ranger.

[theholycow]

Whoops. My mistake. I've had bad experiences where I've mentioned that I need gear oil, only to have the dude behind the counter come out with ATF. Then I go to check the manual and it specifies gear oil or whatever.

Yeah, parts counter folks are like that.

I order online for in-store pickup or get it off the shelf myself (if not behind the counter), but if I had to walk in and ask for it I'd probably specify "75W90 gear oil for a differential" (even if buying for a gearbox) to try to avoid that issue.

[ClutchFork]

Yeah, well a lot of manul trannies specify ATF and I think that is very bad. Definitely go Redline ATF for that app as you don't get much anti wear in off the shelf ATF.

My Ranger specs ATF and I run MTL which is thicker (atf around 7.5 cSt whereas MTL around 10.5 cSt). My '95 F150 was very notchy on ATF even M1 ATF, even Redline ATF, but shifted like a dream with Redline MTL.

Amsoil syncromesh fluid is probaby 1 cst thinner than Redline MTL and may serve you better.