Faulty Chinese-built transmissions plague new Ford Mustang

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Re: Faulty Chinese-built transmissions plague new Ford Musta

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Shadow wrote:
Rope-Pusher wrote:Tremec trans probably costs $1000 more. has more rotational inertia, weighs more, and has higher parasitic losses.

When I worked with Chinese suppliers, they would tell us "The steel is just like SAE grade "98765", but every time we had our metallurgy group check it out, it was one or another grade of Chinesium that was NOTHING like SAE "98765". I'm thinking that by the time you throw enough people at it to "keep them honest", you're better off dealing with more reputable sources and paying for quality parts.

Maybe so, but they still put it in the GT500, even today. I bet if they made the Tremec 6060 a $1000 option on the new Mustang GT, buyers who are aware of the MT82 issues (which is just about anyone who reads any Mustang forum) would have no problems paying the extra grand for a superior transmission with a proven history in powerful Mustangs.
...or that $1000 price increase puts x number of potential buyers that much closer to buying a Camaro instead. Sure, there will always be Ford guys and Chevy guys who won't cross over to the other camp, but for much of the buying public the pricing point is a big influence on sales.

Without knowing what the root cause of the problem is, I wouldn't say that the transmission design isn't suitable for it's intended applications. Getrag is highly regarded in the Amish community, so I'm thinking this is a quality issue that Ford would rather put to bed rather than give up on and accept the trade-offs associated with using the Tremec.
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Re: Faulty Chinese-built transmissions plague new Ford Musta

Post by eggwich delfiero »

This has definitely been an issue from the get-go, so it's kind of funny Jalopnik has it posted as a "Feature." Some commenter was like "Hey Jalopnik, good investigative journalism. Welcome to last year." Hearty lols.

Loved seeing the corral.net reference that was thrown out earlier.

Mustang owners blowing out transmissions seems to be very common. For once, it's due to a design problem rather than just the aftermarket doubling the horsepower and hoping for the best.

The TR6060 is a solid trans, they could have used that, but it's known to make some noise at low rpms that not everyone loves. Plus, like the 3650 in the old GTs, it's a linkage shifter (shifter arm doesn't line up with trans hole (technical term) but is connected via linkage system), which may not really be a big deal, but most of the world would prefer a direct shifter link.

Tremec has been claiming they are building a powerhouse six-speed direct shifter that will fit the 01-10 Mustangs for the last year or so, don't think it exists yet. And it sure won't be cheap.
http://www.s197forum.com/forum/showthre ... ght=Tremec
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Re: Faulty Chinese-built transmissions plague new Ford Musta

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eggwich delfiero wrote:... trans hole (technical term)
That made me lol heartily :lol:
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Re: Faulty Chinese-built transmissions plague new Ford Musta

Post by eggwich delfiero »

Can't you tell I took a transmission repair class? :lol:
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Re: Faulty Chinese-built transmissions plague new Ford Musta

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Of course. After all, the main power source of the car is the explodey thing.
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Re: Faulty Chinese-built transmissions plague new Ford Musta

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94Corolla5Speed wrote:Of course. After all, the main power source of the car is the explodey thing.
Car? What's a "car"? Oh, you mean that thing on the end of the key?
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Re: Faulty Chinese-built transmissions plague new Ford Musta

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eggwich delfiero wrote:
The TR6060 is a solid trans, they could have used that, but it's known to make some noise at low rpms that not everyone loves.
I just don't see too many Mustang guys (especially V8 owners) worrying too much about a little trans noise or whine. Seriously, these are the same guys that love loud exhaust systems and rumbling engines. If I ever own a Mustang again, I'd consider the noise as an intimate part of the driving experience. Either way, it's a good trade-off for a transmission that isn't going to destroy it's synchros with a little abuse.
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Re: Faulty Chinese-built transmissions plague new Ford Musta

Post by eggwich delfiero »

Shadow wrote: I just don't see too many Mustang guys (especially V8 owners) worrying too much about a little trans noise or whine. Seriously, these are the same guys that love loud exhaust systems and rumbling engines. If I ever own a Mustang again, I'd consider the noise as an intimate part of the driving experience. Either way, it's a good trade-off for a transmission that isn't going to destroy it's synchros with a little abuse.
"Dude, what's that rattling noise until you hit about 2K RPMs? You gotta can of coins in the console? That sounds awesome!"--Never gonna happen.
Sure, a little noise isn't a dealbreaker, but when it consistently happens low in the rev range so that you experience every time you drive, it's not a good thing. It is a solid transmission, and I believe they've corrected the noise by this MY. But there are good noises (intake, exhaust) and there are bad noises. You will see macho Mustang people complaining about rear gear whine too after putting 4.10s or lower differential gears in. Driving is a sensory experience and people want their car to sound good, or at least not to sound irritating. People still swap in TR6060s, sure, and awesome people still buy GT500s.
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Re: Faulty Chinese-built transmissions plague new Ford Musta

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eggwich delfiero wrote:
Shadow wrote: I just don't see too many Mustang guys (especially V8 owners) worrying too much about a little trans noise or whine. Seriously, these are the same guys that love loud exhaust systems and rumbling engines. If I ever own a Mustang again, I'd consider the noise as an intimate part of the driving experience. Either way, it's a good trade-off for a transmission that isn't going to destroy it's synchros with a little abuse.
"Dude, what's that rattling noise until you hit about 2K RPMs? You gotta can of coins in the console? That sounds awesome!"--Never gonna happen.
Sure, a little noise isn't a dealbreaker, but when it consistently happens low in the rev range so that you experience every time you drive, it's not a good thing. It is a solid transmission, and I believe they've corrected the noise by this MY. But there are good noises (intake, exhaust) and there are bad noises. You will see macho Mustang people complaining about rear gear whine too after putting 4.10s or lower differential gears in. Driving is a sensory experience and people want their car to sound good, or at least not to sound irritating. People still swap in TR6060s, sure, and awesome people still buy GT500s.
LOL, if you can hear gear whine coming from the rear diff of a Mustang GT, then it is far too quiet (either that, or someone doesn't know how to set backlash even close to correctly). It would be difficult to hear even over the stock exhaust system.
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Re: Faulty Chinese-built transmissions plague new Ford Musta

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paul34 wrote:
Shadow wrote:
eggwich delfiero wrote:
The TR6060 is a solid trans, they could have used that, but it's known to make some noise at low rpms that not everyone loves.
I just don't see too many Mustang guys (especially V8 owners) worrying too much about a little trans noise or whine. Seriously, these are the same guys that love loud exhaust systems and rumbling engines. If I ever own a Mustang again, I'd consider the noise as an intimate part of the driving experience. Either way, it's a good trade-off for a transmission that isn't going to destroy it's synchros with a little abuse.
A lot of V8 Stang owners are those upper middle aged folks who buy the automatic GT convertible. Women buy the red one. They'd both probably care, but then... they're not buying the manual, so I guess my post is wasted.
Yeah, the automatic is for sure the poser transmission for the old folk and women. Maybe that's generalizing, but I'd still say it's pretty much accurate. I've driven plenty of Mustangs with the Tremec 6060 and I can say for sure that it's not excessively noisy. Maybe it wouldn't be suited for a Lexus, but in a Mustang it seems right at home.
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Re: Faulty Chinese-built transmissions plague new Ford Musta

Post by eggwich delfiero »

Shadow wrote:
eggwich delfiero wrote:
Shadow wrote: I just don't see too many Mustang guys (especially V8 owners) worrying too much about a little trans noise or whine. Seriously, these are the same guys that love loud exhaust systems and rumbling engines. If I ever own a Mustang again, I'd consider the noise as an intimate part of the driving experience. Either way, it's a good trade-off for a transmission that isn't going to destroy it's synchros with a little abuse.
"Dude, what's that rattling noise until you hit about 2K RPMs? You gotta can of coins in the console? That sounds awesome!"--Never gonna happen.
Sure, a little noise isn't a dealbreaker, but when it consistently happens low in the rev range so that you experience every time you drive, it's not a good thing. It is a solid transmission, and I believe they've corrected the noise by this MY. But there are good noises (intake, exhaust) and there are bad noises. You will see macho Mustang people complaining about rear gear whine too after putting 4.10s or lower differential gears in. Driving is a sensory experience and people want their car to sound good, or at least not to sound irritating. People still swap in TR6060s, sure, and awesome people still buy GT500s.
LOL, if you can hear gear whine coming from the rear diff of a Mustang GT, then it is far too quiet (either that, or someone doesn't know how to set backlash even close to correctly). It would be difficult to hear even over the stock exhaust system.
Well, hundreds of forum posters have complained about gear whine with lower rear gears, and as they tend to modify other parts of their cars as well, I'd say it's a real issue. Noise and sound aren't the same things in the driving experience. Sure, sometimes it's due to gear alignment or gear brand (cough*Motiv*cough,) but it's definitely prevalent. It seems you've a ton of experience with Mustangs and their owners though, so I'm sure you've heard of it before.
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Re: Faulty Chinese-built transmissions plague new Ford Musta

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eggwich delfiero wrote: It seems you've a ton of experience with Mustangs and their owners though, so I'm sure you've heard of it before.
Actually, that's exactly correct. I've had more than one Mustang GT and I have an entire group of close friends who have also owned them (now and in the past). Maybe it's just my type of friends, but none of them were ever complaining about gear whine. In fact, a very common upgrade on the Mustang is a short throw shifter with positive adjustable. Most guys (including myself) discarded the rubber isolator boot when installing a short throw shifter, which definitely made the noises from the transmission louder in the cabin.

I'll have to take a closer look at the Mustang forums to see if there are really a lot of people complaining about it... If there is, it would be surprising to me. Then again, I ripped out my mufflers the very first day I got my first Mustang. I like my Mustang to make some noise!
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Re: Faulty Chinese-built transmissions plague new Ford Musta

Post by eggwich delfiero »

No mufflers, that's good living. I don't know if I'd want that setup on my daily driver, but I definitely see the appeal. California smog regs don't really give me the chance to think about it anyways.
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Re: Faulty Chinese-built transmissions plague new Ford Musta

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eggwich delfiero wrote:No mufflers, that's good living. I don't know if I'd want that setup on my daily driver, but I definitely see the appeal. California smog regs don't really give me the chance to think about it anyways.
Yeah, it was awesome. Since you can't legally remove the cats, removing the mufflers is the next best thing. The cats sorta act like mufflers anyways...so the car isn't as loud as most people would think. It does make a nice deep sound though.
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Re: Faulty Chinese-built transmissions plague new Ford Musta

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paul34 wrote:Not removing the cats also avoids the whole stinking up every car around you at a stoplight and stinking up all the cars behind you while driving thing, too.

I used to kind of enjoy the smell, but not as much anymore. Here in FL, pretty much every other Mustang with 8 cylinders have no cats, I'm convinced.

It sucks because by the time you smell it, it's too late to close your vents to avoid the smell - it's already in the car.
Actually, the cats are responsible for a stinky "sulfur" smell on many cars. Toyotas are notorious for having stinky cats. Trust me, I have a 4Runner and the smell that comes out the tailpipe when I floor the gas pedal is something awful.
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