Arrrrrrrgh! I can't stand modern cars!

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Arrrrrrrgh! I can't stand modern cars!

Post by ClutchFork » Thu Mar 28, 2013 11:51 am

Too many bells and whistles to the point of making it over complicated. I don't EVER want a touch screen in my car! Here is my list of essentials:

-Manual Transmission (of course :mrgreen: )
-Manual Windows
-Manual Locks
-Analog gauges and odometer, and make those gauges real with numbers, not the Ford dummy oil "gauge" :roll:
-Cable throttle (no drive by wire)
-Fuel Injection and electronic ignition (of course, we are not talking about going back to Model T and such)
-HVAC controls as simple three dial. If it needs separate for the passenger let theirs be complicated, but the driver should be able to adjust without removing eyes from road.
-Radio should be simple dials and push buttons, large enough to manipulate without taking eyes off road. Should be able so surf stations by spinning a dial, none of this push button seek garbage that usually doesn't work right anyway. Sound leveling feature is nice for a car too.

No heated seats, no power seats. And no shift light!

And backup lights that come on anytime but when the car is running and in reverse should be outlawed! (GM you scurvy dogs!)

Five Speeds is fine with 5 as OD so you are running a 4 speed around town. If it's a 6 speed, then I want a creeper gear so that I am still running 4 speed around town. I would love to see a return of column shifters in certain non-performance vehicles.

I will allow for power locks for vehicles with many doors (mini vans in particular), but only so long as you can operate them all fully manually.
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theholycow wrote:Why in the world would you even want to be as smooth as an automatic? Might as well just drive an automatic...

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Re: Arrrrrrrgh! I can't stand modern cars!

Post by 94Corolla5Speed » Thu Mar 28, 2013 12:47 pm

I agree with most of your list but I like auto windows and auto locks. And heated seats? Normally I wouldn't care, but after being in a car with heated seats on a freezing cold day, my ass thinks they're a godsend.

And I completely agree with you on the stupid, STUPID, STUPID GM reverse lights thing when they park. Most moronic thing I've ever seen.

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Re: Arrrrrrrgh! I can't stand modern cars!

Post by six » Thu Mar 28, 2013 1:16 pm

-Manual Transmission (of course :mrgreen: ) - Yes, of course :)
-Manual Windows - Now only on the cheapest of cars, and even that number is dwindling
-Manual Locks - See previous point.
-Analog gauges and odometer - Analog gauges are still the norm, but odos are becoming more and more digital.
-Cable throttle (no drive by wire) - Good luck with this.
-Fuel Injection and electronic ignition - Most cars are still like this.
-HVAC controls as simple three dial - Most cars are still like this, thankfully.
-Radio should be simple dials and push buttons, large enough to manipulate without taking eyes off road. Should be able so surf stations by spinning a dial, none of this push button seek garbage that usually doesn't work right anyway. Sound leveling feature is nice for a car too. - Most factory radios are still like this.

No heated seats, no power seats. And no shift light! - Shift lights are uncommon (and you can always cover it with tape). Heated and power seats are still uncommon.

And backup lights that come on anytime but when the car is running and in reverse should be outlawed! (GM you scurvy dogs!) - I really hate this.
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Re: Arrrrrrrgh! I can't stand modern cars!

Post by tankinbeans » Thu Mar 28, 2013 2:53 pm

94Corolla5Speed wrote:And I completely agree with you on the stupid, STUPID, STUPID GM reverse lights thing when they park. Most moronic thing I've ever seen.
As somebody who used to help with carts, working as a Walbourg, I agree times eleventynine. I remember standing there, with a full load of carts - they only recommened pushing 6-8, but I'd regularly have about 15 by myself - waiting for the dipstick to back out only to realize that it was already in the building or it had just unlocked its car. When I had my Pontiac I disabled that little "feature."
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I'll agree that touchscreens have no place in an automovehicle, but I will admit that having power windows and locks is nice.

My only gripe with the locks in my car is that they don't have posts or buttons on each door, rather there is one switch for the locks in the center console by the radio. It lights up when all doors are locked, but goes out as soon as one door is unlocked. The problem is that you can't figure out which door is unlocked because there are no outward indications. To unlock just one door in the back you have to pull on the handle once to unlock, and again to open. This will shut the light off. You can unlock the front by just pulling the once.

Regarding seat warmers...I beg your pardon Mr. Get Off My Lawn :lol: 8) :twisted: (just kidding) but this young whippersnapper really enjoys them. Now, I do think that cooled seats are a bit excessive.

I do prefer analog gauges, as long as they're truly analog. Those facsimilies are ridiculous. I've seen the few cars that look like they have a television in the dash that lights with all the colors of the rainbow and supplies a digital version of an analog gauge. My only reaction to these is WTF mate!? Either make them digital or analog, not both.

Regarding the rest...I have no opinion one way or another. It's the relentless forward march of technology so I guess it's either get used to it or die.
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Re: Arrrrrrrgh! I can't stand modern cars!

Post by Shadow » Thu Mar 28, 2013 4:41 pm

I like all the bells & whistles. Love 'em all. Except an automatic transmission. Gimme everything else on the list. Actually, the only thing I'd add is that I do prefer an analog gauge package, but I'm perfectly happy with the display screen between my speedo & tach and also with the navigation screen as well.

I want power everything with memory. I want bun warmers. I want a back-up camera (just because it's so awesome to have that I wouldn't want to go back to not having one). I want a hi-tech engine that manages to be relatively powerful and fuel efficient. I want a hard drive built into my stereo so that I can have thousands of songs at my fingertips without ever having to carry CDs or even memory cards, for that matter. I want bi-xenon headlights that really light up the road at night without also blinding oncoming drivers.

BTW, I have all of the above in my car. One thing I'm not too thrilled about is not having an engine oil dipstick. Instead, my car displays the oil level with a graph on the navigation screen. I'd much rather have a real dipstick, but I'm starting to become comfortable with the "electronic" dipstick in my car. I've tested it a few times when I was doing an oil change and it seems to be 100% accurate. I've added oil a quarter of a quart at a time and the electronic graph is always right on the money. Still though, I'd rather have an actual dipstick. Lucky for me, there's still a dipstick tube, so all I have to do is buy a dipstick from the Audi dealership.
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Re: Arrrrrrrgh! I can't stand modern cars!

Post by tankinbeans » Thu Mar 28, 2013 4:54 pm

NO DIPSTICK! What kinds of farsical crap is that? I suppose it's for the people who only know where the fuel filler neck is and couldn't care less about the mechanical gubbins that make the car go.
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Re: Arrrrrrrgh! I can't stand modern cars!

Post by Shadow » Thu Mar 28, 2013 4:58 pm

tankinbeans wrote:NO DIPSTICK! What kinds of farsical crap is that? I suppose it's for the people who only know where the fuel filler neck is and couldn't care less about the mechanical gubbins that make the car go.
Don't be too surprised. We'll probably see more and more cars without dipsticks. Hell, my 4Runner is almost 9 years old now and it doesn't have a transmission dipstick.

Anyway, as long as the electronic dipstick is accurate and reliable, then I honestly don't have a problem with it. I still haven't purchased a dipstick from my local Audi dealer, so I guess that goes to show you that I'm okay with the electronic dipstick for now.
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Re: Arrrrrrrgh! I can't stand modern cars!

Post by tankinbeans » Thu Mar 28, 2013 5:09 pm

True. The transmission probably doesn't have one because it's "sealed for life" and requires "no maintenance". The Malibu doesn't have one either. For dumb.
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InlinePaul wrote:The driving force of new fangled features to sell more cars [is to] cater to the masses' abject laziness!

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Re: Arrrrrrrgh! I can't stand modern cars!

Post by Bill B » Thu Mar 28, 2013 8:12 pm

Someone told me that my Element must be the stripped down version. That is the way I prefer it. Mine is actually EX model with a few more bells than the LX. Has analog guages, and dials for the heater & AC. It has power windows, but I would have been fine with the wind up ones. My backup camera is the rearview mirror.
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Re: Arrrrrrrgh! I can't stand modern cars!

Post by theholycow » Thu Mar 28, 2013 8:18 pm

I like a mixture...and since we're talking about cars that won't exist:

- Manual transmission. The more gears, the better. Spaced like my 2008 VW was, I could easily use 12-15 speeds. Spaced more the way I like, 7 speeds would suffice.

- I've preferred manual windows for most of my life but lately have gained an appreciation for power windows -- but not the kind that GM makes. The VW's were pretty decent. I want them to be FAST, I want them to have auto-up and auto-down for all windows.

- Power locks, but not automated at all. I hate when the vehicle thinks it's smarter than me and locks/unlocks when I haven't commanded it to do so. Must have complete manual lock functionality at all locations.

- Analog gauges, though I wouldn't mind a HUD. Definitely real numbers. Digital odometer doesn't bother me.

- Cable throttle absolutely...except the next one might conflict:

- Direct injection. With direct injection, throttle isn't necessarily going to operate the same and may need to be DBW. Must be programmed to act like a cable throttle though.

- Cruise control. If DBW, must have accelerator pedal actuator simulating what the pedal would do if my foot was operating it; I use my foot as a sensor to know what my cruise is doing. The dead accelerator with cruise in DBW is a real bother.

- All control systems fully programmable by me. Fuel, ignition, etc. On-the-fly switching between programs, etc.

- HVAC controls: Temp dial mechanically connected to blend door, fan dial, toggle/rocker switches or mechanical on-off buttons for everything else. I sometimes want combinations not offered by the output selection dial. I'd make an exception for a dial that has a direct mechanical linkage to the door/flap/valve/whatever system though.

- Air conditioning must NOT come on automatically when I turn on the defogger. Most of the time I'm trying to melt ice on the outside, not remove condensation from the inside.

- Radio more complicated than the space shuttle. Bring it on. No touch screen though; there is NO room for touch screen operation while driving, all controls should be tactile. USB, SD, bluetooth, SSD, wifi, etc etc etc.

- Manual seats with complete adjustments. I hate power seats, though I'd prefer memory power seats in a vehicle I share with someone else. I don't mind heated as long as there's a good quality switch that isn't going to accidentally get turned on; only time I'll use it is if my heat fails.

- All lighting (exterior AND interior) subject to individual manual overrides, on or off. Could be a bigass toggle switch panel or a touch screen, I won't do most of these while driving.

- Classic key-operated ignition switch. I want to stick my key in my steering column, turn it, and have it operate a real switch that really cuts off/turns on electric power to the ignition system. Remote starter can bypass it, of course.

- Mechanical, cable, drum parking brake.

- Column shifters on all slushboxen, all manuals deserve a nice forward-mounted floor shifter with nice long stick placing the knob at my fingertips when my elbow is on the armrest. Shifter coming through the console shifts nicely but takes a position that I prefer either has seating (granted, useless seating in a manual) or storage.

- Rod linkage clutch. Ok, can't say I know for sure I'd like it, but I'm pretty sure I would.

- Windshield squirter that doesn't keep running the wipers when you quit squirting. Squirt BEFORE the wipers begin moving, wipers run while continuing to squirt, wipers finish and park when I let go of the control. I'll run them more if necessary. I HATE the wipers scraping dry salt before the squirter squirts, and I HATE the wipers smearing what would evaporate cleanly after I quit squirting.

- Manual remote passenger mirror. Manual drivers mirror.

- Center mirror: Temp and compass, classic manual dimming, with multiple levels of dim. Slap some tint on it too, I never want it full-brightness, ever.

- Anti-lock brakes. Would consider stability control too only if it has a real toggle switch so it can be shut off and never come on until I turn it back on.

- Tire pressure monitoring system? Ok. Passive-style please, nothing requiring sensors in the wheels.

- NO AUTOMATIC HEADLIGHTS! No headlight daytime running lights either. Would accept amber/tail lights as DRLs.

- No rear wiper and no rear window defroster. Dark tint in it.

- Sensors for every fluid's level, pressure, and temperature, but that is no excuse to skip the dipstick.

- Switchable locking differential. I'll lock it when I want.

- RWD. 4WD in a truck, with electronic transfer case and Auto4WD option; this doesn't mean Auto4WD is the only 4WD you can use, just that you can use it when you want. I have that, works great when on spotty roads. Don't use it anymore due to mismatched tires and wacky front differential.

- Electric power steering. No hydraulic fluid please. VW did a GREAT job on this, and a few controls letting me select programs or manually adjust it per my current mood would be even greater.

- Power sunroof. I haven't seen a manual one that can slide into the roof.

- Programmable/manually selectable shock absorber valving and leveling.

Ok, that's all I can think of at the moment. I'll post more when I think of them.
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Re: Arrrrrrrgh! I can't stand modern cars!

Post by tankinbeans » Thu Mar 28, 2013 9:48 pm

I read the part about needing manual controls for the radio and thought it said you need manual controls for your wife. :shock:
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Re: Arrrrrrrgh! I can't stand modern cars!

Post by AHTOXA » Thu Mar 28, 2013 10:10 pm

I'm with Shadow on this one. I like gadgets and I like it in cars. Now, there are exceptions, like the auto rev matching thing in the Nissan but overall, I love it. The blind spot warning in the new Mercs works great and it's really neat, along with seatwarmers, touchscreens, integrated everything stuff, power everything stuff and so on.

Sure, I can turn my head and check the blind spot, and I still would out of habit, but I still think that the system on the Mercs is great and would want it in my car if I were shopping for a car of that class. Same goes for many gadgets, as long as they are not intrusive to the driver and the way I want to drive.
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Re: Arrrrrrrgh! I can't stand modern cars!

Post by ClutchFork » Thu Mar 28, 2013 10:30 pm

Thank You theholycow for posting many things I didn't cover. Manual lever operated clutch linkage was in my 1977 F100 and it worked just fine. For sure would not have to deal with leaky slave cylinders. MY mentality in 1977 was totally stripped down--the less stuff on it, the less to go wrong. Besides the full manual lever clutch linkage, it had manual steering, brakes did not have a power assist, crank windows, manual door locks, lever heater controls, no AC, and a big wide flat metal dashboard where you could mount all sorts of stuff. Back when I had no AC I would have gone for a power window on the passenger side, but now I have no reason to open that window unless I am the passenger.
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Re: Arrrrrrrgh! I can't stand modern cars!

Post by tankinbeans » Thu Mar 28, 2013 10:38 pm

I couldn't deal with only having one window open. When it's warm out, but not hot and humid enough to justify ac, I have all windows open and the sunroof. Hell I've even risen like this in 35 degree weather, it's the Minnesotan in me I guess.

Generally electronic gubbins don't big me, but I'm a semi-Luddite in that I don't want to study for hours to work my car.
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Re: Arrrrrrrgh! I can't stand modern cars!

Post by Rope-Pusher » Thu Mar 28, 2013 11:10 pm

I've seen a boat that had a dipstick...for the gas tank! You opened the fuel cap, pushed a wooden stick down the hole until it bumped the bottom of the tank, pulled it back out and looked to see how far up the stick the wet mark came. Anything more technical than this is superfluous!
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