Refining Technique & Scenario Based Q's

[tankinbeans]

Mooey bean. I'm glad you're getting the hang of driving the rig. Also red is my favorite color. Carry on.

[Teamwork]

dude, i thought you died. gotta do like me and post random meaningless stuff every few days

Haha, I really lurk in the background here once a day or so.

sounds about right. i don't always rev match, especially when shifting into the appropriate gear for the speed the car's rolling.

I don't want to call it lazy though it may seem like it might be some of that but it's more that I don't want to commit a brain over load. I can't remember who it was specifically (though it may of been you or Shadow) that said to "rev match when in doubt any chance possible" but in the later pages of this thread Cow assessed that this was pretty much fine in said scenario and normal. I don't feel any oddities or horrific jerks when doing this and I usually take it easy on the clutch when resuming in said 'highest gear' (lowest rpm that is healthy) possible.

i hear you on this one. first is too low but 2nd too high, right?? i dealt with that the other day - was going around a parking lot in 2nd and felt like the car was accelerating on its own. had to ride the brakes to keep the car from taking off. you will eventually use 2nd more and not be as bothered by the low engine speed, vibrations and potential runaway car risk. i also find myself using higher gears than i did in other cars, since my engine and car can still accelerate at (somewhat) lower rpms than most other cars i've had.

It really isn't the worst unless it's really busy and I have someone trailing behind me. Being that you've been to Nassau County and probably have had to deal with parking lots in a manual/automatic car- you understand that when you get into a busy parking lot establishment that it's pretty much anarchy. Traffic laws, sane speeds, and right of ways go out the window and you have to pretty much be johnny on the spot for any asinine act that you could dream of becoming reality. The last time I actually stalled the car probably back in November or December was in a situation where I was trying to "teeter" being in 2nd gear at 9 mph and a car abruptly backing up in front of me and having to be quick on the brakes and not quick enough on putting the clutch back down. This probably has to do with me wanting to stay in 1st for as long as possible- and really if I'm switching to 2nd I'm most likely going to have to switch back into 1st within 10-20 feet anyway. I know a lot of people from other states are probably like just find a spot in a secluded area and be done with it but the problem is most of the time I am looking for a spot in some smaller business parking lots it's literally the only available spot in the entire lot (not an exaggeration). In really large parking lots for like supermarkets I usually just park in the back and be done with it though. My gym parking lot is one of the worst offenders of the latter though because it shares a parking lot with other businesses and is legal train yard parking for the LIRR so it's really you go up and down the rows and take what you can GET if there even is anything. I'm 95% sure that most of my door dings are here as well because it's literally one of the very few times I don't park a mile away from everyone.
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I don't have a specific quote for you Cow but just to reassess the 1st gear no gas launch and going into reverse with no gas it's kind of a loaded accusation. The most common time I have to reverse and make a conscious effort of doing so with some distance (so feathering the clutch in and out) is reversing up my driveway which is on an incline- so maybe that's why the engine note turns semi gravely because I try to balance the gas using the least amount possible because less gas is better then too much gas (because too much gas equals crashing into the side of my garage). When I do reverse in and cold start the next day I usually crawl up to the tip of my driveway in 1st gear using no gas and usually I ease into it slowly and I'll feel a "bump" and a sound change when I know I've made it to the friction point.

There is not sufficient language with which I could label this issue. "Inconsequential" doesn't suffice to express the extent of how minuscule the difference is.

Declutched and in gear: You turn off engine. Engine stops. Clutch and input shaft are at a stop because you are in gear and not in motion. You take your foot off the clutch pedal and the clutch says hello to the flywheel.

Clutch engaged and in neutral: You turn off engine. Clutch and input shaft are stopped by engine. Gears and synchronizers are at a stop because you are in gear and not in motion. You shift into gear and the transmission guts say hello to each other.

I only ask because naturally I did it- shutting the car off in neutral and then moving the lever into the gear after the car was off. Admittedly I had to program my brain not be scared letting off the clutch in 2nd gear when the car wasn't moving when it was off when I was really new. I ask because of this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aNKXCLwpGZ4

The MK7 generation of the Golf is vastly different in each market even though it is labeled as a 'world car'. One of the biggest differences within the different markets is the US (I'm unsure about Canada) is the only market that receives a mechanical hand brake. It's an electronic button everywhere else... That's fine and all but the issue here is that the mechanical brake feels like an "after thought" on these cars and is pretty sloppily implemented in terms of feel when pulling up the brake and it's line sagging underneath the car. Literally the lowest point of the car is the brake line...

http://i66.tinypic.com/23mmwpg.jpg

I'm not sure why that's important, but since it is, why not use reverse? That has more leverage than 2nd, often even more than 1st.

I do use reverse when the car is pointed downwards on a decline.

[theholycow]

I don't have a specific quote for you Cow but just to reassess the 1st gear no gas launch and going into reverse with no gas it's kind of a loaded accusation. The most common time I have to reverse and make a conscious effort of doing so with some distance (so feathering the clutch in and out) is reversing up my driveway which is on an incline- so maybe that's why the engine note turns semi gravely because I try to balance the gas using the least amount possible because less gas is better then too much gas (because too much gas equals crashing into the side of my garage).

More gas, less clutch. Slip the clutch. That's what it's there for. I know you've been deeply indoctrinated with the idea that you should never ever do that, but that's not how it is. The biggest problem with that is likely to be difficulty getting good at it...it can be tough to get exactly the RPM and clutch friction level that you want.

I only ask because naturally I did it- shutting the car off in neutral and then moving the lever into the gear after the car was off.

That's fine.

I ask because of this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aNKXCLwpGZ4

I think you may have misunderstood. He left the car parked in neutral; he doesn't mean he merely had it in neutral while cutting the engine. By leaving the car in neutral, there was no redundant system preventing the car from rolling.

He says he has heard that leaving it in gear is bad for the gearbox. This is like a game of "telephone". It is not. It has been said that universal joints and maybe CV joints can be put under stress this way, but that's not even the tiniest fraction of normal driving stresses, even if you let the car roll back and take up the slack after shutting the engine off.

the mechanical brake feels like an "after thought" on these cars and is pretty sloppily implemented in terms of feel when pulling up the brake and it's line sagging underneath the car. Literally the lowest point of the car is the brake line...

http://i66.tinypic.com/23mmwpg.jpg

Bummer. I was happy with the hanbrake on my MKV.

That photo looks like there's a clip on the sagging line that came undone from the car.

I do use reverse when the car is pointed downwards on a decline.

There's no need to choose a gear based on which direction the car faces on a hill. If I'm parsing your language correctly, you're choosing a gear that would turn the engine backwards if the car starts rolling; there's nothing wrong with that but I'd be curious about the logic. What's most important is the mechanical advantage, and Reverse or 1st has the best.

[Teamwork]

More gas, less clutch. Slip the clutch. That's what it's there for. I know you've been deeply indoctrinated with the idea that you should never ever do that, but that's not how it is. The biggest problem with that is likely to be difficulty getting good at it...it can be tough to get exactly the RPM and clutch friction level that you want.

I feel good about it.. most inconsistencies here stem from poorly setting the gas or not being consistent with the movements of the feet- balancing. I was reading a thread that was a few pages back and some guy was asking why European driving instructors always preach 'set the gas first before even moving the clutch out.' Is it a precautionary thing for newer drivers since it minimizes the chances of stalling? I still pretty much do gas and lift off on the clutch near at the same time if not a bit of gas a millisecond or two before hand... Overall in my conscious thought process it feels spontaneous. I feel like there's at least one question a page revolving around how long slipping the clutch/riding the clutch is okay for so I'll refrain from asking. I do notice that a part of my problem was I was fully letting out (going through the bite) too quickly which accounted for a lot of my rough starts at the end of last summer. Occasionally, I'll fish hook myself in 1st gear... it feels horrible and fish hook is what it feels like exactly. It'll be teetering on smoothness and then all of a sudden it'll jerk the occupants hard and resume. If I have to make an educated guess here to why it happens (I'm entirely not positive) I would say it has to do with letting off the gas after having it set too low while doing "normal" lift off with the clutch. I believe it's because the revs were a little above idle and then dropping back to idle level when not fully engaged into 1st yet. Feels horrible... I've done it once or twice with my girlfriend in the car and honestly it's the only thing she's ever pointed out. I'll even ask her specifically when I feel like its "rough" and she'll say "not noticeable". She definitely isn't oblivious or a yes-man either... when I was fairly new I'd basically speak out loud in a narration form to say what I was doing or needed to do. I know that sounds crazed but it really helped programming my brain. I also quiz her on what I do certain things like, "wiggle the shift knob left to right", "why I'll blip the throttle and down shift", "and why I leave the car in gear after I turn it off". She's never had a wrong answer either... I digress but I've never had a girlfriend whose really accepted cars as a hobby for me. The last one I had wanted me to "grow up".

I think you may have misunderstood. He left the car parked in neutral; he doesn't mean he merely had it in neutral while cutting the engine. By leaving the car in neutral, there was no redundant system preventing the car from rolling.

He says he has heard that leaving it in gear is bad for the gearbox. This is like a game of "telephone". It is not. It has been said that universal joints and maybe CV joints can be put under stress this way, but that's not even the tiniest fraction of normal driving stresses, even if you let the car roll back and take up the slack after shutting the engine off.

Not the correct video that I referenced but I saw a "professional" driver instructor say the proper way to park was holding the clutch down with the car in 1st gear as you turn it off. I was more or less showing off this video as the reason why I always leave my car in gear when parked. It's a force of habit for me but since a lot of the time I park my car on my driveway for hours at a time (which I don't even need reverse gear to back out of) I wanted to get a formal understanding that what I'm doing is good and that I won't wake up with my car crashed into parked cars at the end of the street. I don't have any affiliation with this kid's video but I do have to say that it feels bone headed and his excuse of reading it on the internet doesn't help the cause. I don't always remember to turn my wheels but at the very least I'll remember to keep it in gear.

Bummer. I was happy with the hanbrake on my MKV.

That photo looks like there's a clip on the sagging line that came undone from the car.

Not my car in the photo but I have a picture that's exactly like this (except the body is red). I got it checked out by VW and so have others and they all come away saying no hangers or clips broken- it is what it is. I don't feel any looseness around my e-brake when pulling it up but many have reported so. I actually used the e-brake hill start when I was really new and getting super sweaty on the hills but I'm quick and competent enough not to do that anymore. I'm guessing you can't do that with an electronic button brake lol...

There's no need to choose a gear based on which direction the car faces on a hill. If I'm parsing your language correctly, you're choosing a gear that would turn the engine backwards if the car starts rolling; there's nothing wrong with that but I'd be curious about the logic. What's most important is the mechanical advantage, and Reverse or 1st has the best.

A lot of my logic is just based on things I've read and heard (going back to the "because internet"). It's not that I believe most of what is said but it's why I like having long, lengthy, well thought out posts and responses. I'm going to go off on a rant on this one and say that there's so much confusing, conflicting, and down right false information regarding the topic of operating a manual transmission that the internet for me personally was almost a hindrance. Until I somehow stumbled across here I was basically trying to contact people personally and ask them similar questions and receive tips from them if they had in my mind, proven credentials. Forget about bringing up subjects like this on reddit, wiki, any car club forums, or you tube comments section- you'll be filtering more filth then anything else. I only wish I stumbled across here when I first got the car because a lot of these threads are filled with great logic based, and proven knowledge.

In short, to answer your question I think I just saw it in my head that if the car was facing downwards that by having it in reverse would bring more resistance if the e-brake released and vice versa. I do put it into 2nd gear because from my POV when I would first get into the car it was really much more obvious that it was left in gear then any of the north positions. Honestly, on a side subject I still get scared because reverse and 1st feel like they are in a very similar position but putting the lever into 1st feels significantly different then putting it through the 1st gear gate. Reverse feels very mushy...

[theholycow]

I was reading a thread that was a few pages back and some guy was asking why European driving instructors always preach 'set the gas first before even moving the clutch out.' Is it a precautionary thing for newer drivers since it minimizes the chances of stalling?

I would guess that it is an efficient way to teach more people in less time and move on with life. It is an acceptable technique, though in my opinion it is crude. Speaking of which, I know there is an assumption that all things European are inherently more refined, but in this context I understand that quite the opposite is true, and logic supports it; in places where manual transmissions are as overwhelmingly common as automatics are in the US, you can expect more of the drivers to be people who really don't care about the finer points of manual transmission driving, people for whom the vehicle is merely a tool to be used up and discarded, who just want their appliance to tote them to their destination.

I don't always remember to turn my wheels but at the very least I'll remember to keep it in gear.

Parking a manual and parking an automatic should be the same except that you use position 'P' in an automatic and '1' or 'R' in a manual (and clutch stuff). Turn wheels, select shifter position, operate parking brake (in whichever order you prefer). Even the oversensitive concerns about driveline stress and such are close to identical.

I actually used the e-brake hill start when I was really new and getting super sweaty on the hills but I'm quick and competent enough not to do that anymore. I'm guessing you can't do that with an electronic button brake lol...

According to posts I've read, it will release automatically when you attempt to launch.

In short, to answer your question I think I just saw it in my head that if the car was facing downwards that by having it in reverse would bring more resistance if the e-brake released and vice versa.

No. The engine spins backwards as easily as forwards. Leverage is all that matters. ALL HAIL LEVERAGE!

Honestly, on a side subject I still get scared because reverse and 1st feel like they are in a very similar position but putting the lever into 1st feels significantly different then putting it through the 1st gear gate. Reverse feels very mushy...

I forgot about VW's pattern placing Reverse next to 1st. I found Reverse instead of 1st a couple times, it's very surprising and I instinctually aborted before I moved more than an inch.

[Teamwork]

I would guess that it is an efficient way to teach more people in less time and move on with life. It is an acceptable technique, though in my opinion it is crude.

I mean when I was really fresh and new I would make a notable effort to set the gas before movement of my foot on the clutch. As time went on I just refined myself to the point where it feels like I can do both movements and balance at the same time. Noting that other thread though the OP said that he either hears people setting the gas well before, or doing a blipping sound while launching in 1st. What's up with that also because I have an STI and WRX on the same block as me and I constantly hear that too. It literally sounds like tapping the gas pedal 2-3 times and moving out of 1st slowly...

I forgot about VW's pattern placing Reverse next to 1st. I found Reverse instead of 1st a couple times, it's very surprising and I instinctually aborted before I moved more than an inch.

It's a little tricky but I probably have more anxiety about being in 1st when I really wanted reverse. At night there's a little more fail safing going on because I have adaptive front lights so if I put the car into reverse it's at max illumination to the sides of the front of the vehicle- it's really obvious when it's on and always does this when in reverse. Other then that I just rely on the feeling through the gate... reverse feels really mushy compared to all forward gears.

[Rope-Pusher]

In a slushbox, the parking pawl is often hard to retract when it is bearing a load. Repeatedly pulling a slushbox out of Park when it is parked on a steep incline, especially if the vehicle is heavily loaded, can degrade the park pawl system and result in even higher efforts to pull out of Park (or even worse things, like broken shift cables, bent transmission shift levers and a bad case of "the mud chiggers"). If one, or two, were driving a slushbox vehicle, they might want to apply the service brake and hold it in the apply position as they shift into Park and continue to hold it applied as they actuate the parking brake in an effort to reduce the forces acting on the park pawl.

If one, or two, were driving a vehicle of the Amish persuasion, they would "Follow the Cow, 'cause he knows how".

(If there are any doubters out there, Shirley ewe our familiar with the expression "How now Brown Cow?", which is uddered by many as they place their trust in the Cow-Man's worms of wisdom)

[Rope-Pusher]

Put your hand in the hoof of the Cow
Who shifted a VW
Put your hand in the hoof of the Cow
With the Amish Buick
Take a look at yourself
And you can look at others differently
By puttin' your hand in the hoof of the Cow
From a Gloucester

Every time I look into Standard Shift
I wanna shake
When I read about the part where
the nube driver makes a mistake
For the grinders and the stallers were no different fellas
Than what I profess to be
And it causes me pain to know that
I'm not the driver I should be

Mama taught me how to shift before
I reached the age of seven-teen
And when I'm shifting thru the gears
That's a when I'm close to heaven
Cow took Grandmaw’s car and made it a star
by swappin’ in a T-5 Trans
You do what you must do
But he showed me enough of what
It takes to get you through

[theholycow]

If one, or two, were driving a slushbox vehicle, they might want to apply the service brake and hold it in the apply position as they shift into Park and continue to hold it applied as they actuate the parking brake in an effort to reduce the forces acting on the park pawl.

Alternatively, one (or as many as can fit in the driver's seat) can apply the parking brake before even shifting into Park. If one (or more) then were to release the service brake, still before putting it into Park, that would result in an excellent low-cost daily diagnostic test of the parking brake system's efficacy.

[Rope-Pusher]

If one, or two, were driving a slushbox vehicle, they might want to apply the service brake and hold it in the apply position as they shift into Park and continue to hold it applied as they actuate the parking brake in an effort to reduce the forces acting on the park pawl.

Alternatively, one (or as many as can fit in the driver's seat) can apply the parking brake before even shifting into Park. If one (or more) then were to release the service brake, still before putting it into Park, that would result in an excellent low-cost daily diagnostic test of the parking brake system's efficacy.

Sure, one, or a multiple of 1 could do it that way also. They'd be wrong, and they'd ruin their transmission, parking brake and engine, but they COULD do it that way.

[theholycow]

Sure, one, or a multiple of 1 could do it that way also. They'd be wrong, and they'd ruin their transmission, parking brake and engine, but they COULD do it that way.

These are the risks we take when stepping on a crack. Our poor mothers! It is unavoidable.

[Rope-Pusher]

Crack? Did I hear someone say they got some crack?

[potownrob]

dude, i thought you died. gotta do like me and post random meaningless stuff every few days

Haha, I really lurk in the background here once a day or so.

i usually post when i'm on the real computer and on this site, which is during the week (usually while at work). i'm usually AWOL from here over the weekend since i'm usually not on a desktop and find it awkward to look at this site on my iphone or ipad.

sounds about right. i don't always rev match, especially when shifting into the appropriate gear for the speed the car's rolling.

I don't want to call it lazy though it may seem like it might be some of that but it's more that I don't want to commit a brain over load. I can't remember who it was specifically (though it may of been you or Shadow) that said to "rev match when in doubt any chance possible" but in the later pages of this thread Cow assessed that this was pretty much fine in said scenario and normal. I don't feel any oddities or horrific jerks when doing this and I usually take it easy on the clutch when resuming in said 'highest gear' (lowest rpm that is healthy) possible.

i might've emphasized rev-matching at one point, but i was picturing you or whoever the OP was downshifting into a gear that would need a lot more gas for the given (or assumed) speed. there are plenty of times where you won't need to rev-match though.

i hear you on this one. first is too low but 2nd too high, right?? i dealt with that the other day - was going around a parking lot in 2nd and felt like the car was accelerating on its own. had to ride the brakes to keep the car from taking off. you will eventually use 2nd more and not be as bothered by the low engine speed, vibrations and potential runaway car risk. i also find myself using higher gears than i did in other cars, since my engine and car can still accelerate at (somewhat) lower rpms than most other cars i've had.

It really isn't the worst unless it's really busy and I have someone trailing behind me. Being that you've been to Nassau County and probably have had to deal with parking lots in a manual/automatic car- you understand that when you get into a busy parking lot establishment that it's pretty much anarchy. Traffic laws, sane speeds, and right of ways go out the window and you have to pretty much be johnny on the spot for any asinine act that you could dream of becoming reality. The last time I actually stalled the car probably back in November or December was in a situation where I was trying to "teeter" being in 2nd gear at 9 mph and a car abruptly backing up in front of me and having to be quick on the brakes and not quick enough on putting the clutch back down. This probably has to do with me wanting to stay in 1st for as long as possible- and really if I'm switching to 2nd I'm most likely going to have to switch back into 1st within 10-20 feet anyway. I know a lot of people from other states are probably like just find a spot in a secluded area and be done with it but the problem is most of the time I am looking for a spot in some smaller business parking lots it's literally the only available spot in the entire lot (not an exaggeration). In really large parking lots for like supermarkets I usually just park in the back and be done with it though. My gym parking lot is one of the worst offenders of the latter though because it shares a parking lot with other businesses and is legal train yard parking for the LIRR so it's really you go up and down the rows and take what you can GET if there even is anything. I'm 95% sure that most of my door dings are here as well because it's literally one of the very few times I don't park a mile away from everyone.

i always forget about the tight and busy parking lots down there. when i'm down there it's usually not prime time (evening into overnight usually) but, even then, it can be a little busy compared to what i'm used to. not that we don't have busy parking lots up here, but in general they're more spread out, have more spots (and bigger spots IIRC), and traffic isn't as bad (it's more spread out up here). this difference is nothing compared to the difference between our parking lots and traffic and those you find in the city (all boroughs, not just manhattan).
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I'm not sure why that's important, but since it is, why not use reverse? That has more leverage than 2nd, often even more than 1st.

I do use reverse when the car is pointed downwards on a decline.

i read somewhere, way back when, that 2nd has close to the same leverage as reverse. also read that it's better to be in a gear you could skip in case your car gets hit while in gear. these are probably both old wive's tails (and not all trannies are geared alike), but i do still leave it in 2nd instead of reverse if not on an incline or afraid of being hit head-on.

[theholycow]

i read somewhere, way back when, that 2nd has close to the same leverage as reverse. also read that it's better to be in a gear you could skip in case your car gets hit while in gear. these are probably both old wive's tails (and not all trannies are geared alike), but i do still leave it in 2nd instead of reverse if not on an incline or afraid of being hit head-on.

You can easily tell that Reverse's ratio is similar to 1st's by the fact that you can crawl at about the same speed in both. If Reverse had leverage similar to 2nd then backing up would be really irritating with even more clutch slipping, less torque put to the ground, and less ability for crawl speed.

2015 Accord manual transmissions:
1st: 3.643, 2nd: 2.080, 3rd: 1.361, 4th: 1.024, 5th: 0.830, 6th: 0.686, Reverse: 3.673
1st: 3.933, 2nd: 2.478, 3rd: 1.700, 4th: 1.250, 5th: 0.976, 6th: 0.771, Reverse: 4.008

Not that an engaged gear would break if the car was hit while parked (unless it was hit so hard that it couldn't be driven anyway), but I think I'd rather launch in 2nd than have to jump 1st to 3rd.

[Teamwork]

i might've emphasized rev-matching at one point, but i was picturing you or whoever the OP was downshifting into a gear that would need a lot more gas for the given (or assumed) speed. there are plenty of times where you won't need to rev-match though.

Honestly, I do try and match rev's whenever feasible but I really can't adjust my mind (maybe someone will drill it harder and I can) to blipping the throttle when I'm slowing down and need to get down to a lower gear to resume traffic conditions. I think it has to do with the fact that I'm originally braking in the mind set that I might potentially have to fully stop so the idea of getting on the gas after braking isn't processing well for me but most of the time I try countering this by getting into the highest gear (lowest rpm) feasible so at least when I get back off the clutch that my rev's don't have to go from idle to something significantly higher. I don't feel anything "wrong" when I do this but I have to be careful I def choose the highest "low rpm" gear possible.

Whenever I take a 90 degree turn I'll try and blip into 2nd unless I know I can resume into 3rd (late at night I mostly can carry enough speed). I typically don't blip just right going back into 2nd but it's usually enough to ease into the lower gear without any jerks or shakes. I had huge problems achieving this and was highlighted in the beginning of this journey thread- I wasn't sure if I was missing the bigger picture.

i always forget about the tight and busy parking lots down there. when i'm down there it's usually not prime time (evening into overnight usually) but, even then, it can be a little busy compared to what i'm used to. not that we don't have busy parking lots up here, but in general they're more spread out, have more spots (and bigger spots IIRC), and traffic isn't as bad (it's more spread out up here). this difference is nothing compared to the difference between our parking lots and traffic and those you find in the city (all boroughs, not just manhattan).

I would never own or drive a car in the city most likely or maybe I'd get like a Fiat 500 (non abarth). I'm glad you can relate to some of the Long Island, Nassau County complaints though. I mean most of these people just have a death wish and want to share it with the world or are just flat out wreck less. I will literally get passed on the highway all the time doing 70 in a 55 mph here... and then I'll get honked out slowly rolling through parking lots at 8 mph with literally people walking in front of cars left and right. I really don't know how some people get away with driving mid size SUV's because sometimes I'll park in a bay where literally my Golf is hugging inside the lines on each side. It probably is a nightmare.

Potown speaking of "high speed" highways... my friend recently got an ECU tune and was testing the maps late at night on Ocean Parkway during the week. Literally, said he was the only guy out there at like 1 am.. but the "only guy" besides the police sleeping on the dividers.
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Don't worry guys I'm "parking" with my car in 1st or reverse now. Again, I was only doing 2nd because when I first started out it was more visible from the drivers POV that it was in a gear and obvious so I would remember taking it out of gear before letting off the clutch. Anything north of the shifter or even reverse, which we just talked about kind of looks like 1st at a glance wasn't plain as day obvious for a newbie.

I just wanted to re-quote something I said that didn't get much attention before...

Noting that other thread though the OP said that he either hears people setting the gas well before, or doing a blipping sound while launching in 1st. What's up with that also because I have an STI and WRX on the same block as me and I constantly hear that too. It literally sounds like tapping the gas pedal 2-3 times and moving out of 1st slowly...

In conjunction with this I feel like at time's I lose confidence launching out of 1st gear and might still need more work on it. It's not to the point where I'll stall (knock on wood) but sometimes if I have a jerky launch it'll really weigh on my mind and I feel like I lose confidence. It doesn't even happen that often but they'll be a time where I fish hook trying to roll out in 1st gear and I've been trying to diagnose the issue. I'll be starting out for the first few steps fine and the car will begin rolling and then it like "fish hooks" or hangs up on something. At first I thought it was because I wasn't steady enough on the clutch and going in, out, and back in the friction point but I'm starting to notice that it'll happen if I set the gas and let the rpm's drop too much without compensating for it. It's def too hard to describe but it literally feels like I'm getting snagged on something and is a fairly violent jerk. It'll happen maybe once a week during a "bad launch" - feel terrible regarding it.

Also, I kind of slipped 2nd on a resuming traffic scenario today by either luck, will, or the grace of a higher power. It was mostly an accident but it worked out pretty good. I just want to get checked that what I'm doing is fine... I was really on that thresh hold 7-8 mph and the car in front of me starting going, braked lightly (didn't full stop), and continued moving (FML) and I already committed in my mind 2nd by the time he braked/starting moving nearly instantly I basically started feathering out the clutch in 2nd gear- I know for a fact my digital read out said 7 mph and I lightly gas'ed while in the friction point until I got the speedo back to 10-11 mph before fully lifting off. It honestly felt like I was 1st gear launching but just in 2nd. I didn't hold it there for much longer then when I hold it for 1st gear either and I was kind of concerned but I knew I had to ride it a little or I most likely would've stalled in 2nd gear. I was pretty satisfied when nothing catastrophic happened and no odd symptoms or smells.