New manual driver, have some questions

[ClutchFork]

If your coming into a stop sign, of course you would shift into first before coming to a stop. That way you can take off quickly.

[theholycow]

+1

Not only can you take off immediately after coming to a complete stop, but you can DC into 1st at idle speed.

[daleadbull]

+1

Not only can you take off immediately after coming to a complete stop, but you can DC into 1st at idle speed.

That's true but OP is trying to force it into 1st at speeds over 20 mph, which is not a good thing. Some cars even lock you out of 1st over a certain speed.

If you are in a real hurry to come to stop and immediately take off and DC is not an option (some people don't know how or are new or simply not comfortable with it). I would just stay in the current gear and right before coming to a full stop put it into 1st then go. DC is the last thing a new stick driver should be attempting IMO, it will be grind city. You guys agree?

[theholycow]

I would just stay in the current gear and right before coming to a full stop put it into 1st then go. DC is the last thing a new stick driver should be attempting IMO, it will be grind city. You guys agree?

If you put it in neutral before/while braking then DCing into 1st is just a matter of staying in neutral and right before coming to a full stop put it into 1st then go. That's why I said DC into 1st at idle.

[tankinbeans]

DC is the last thing a new stick driver should be attempting IMO, it will be grind city. You guys agree?

I would agree. It took me months before I finally decided to try it. The first few times I did it I always ground 4th. It wasn't pretty, but then I started going out on empty roads and practiced. I always tried to maintain the same speed in 3 different gears (at the time I had a 6 speed, so would DC 6-5, 5-4 and see if I could do it without losing any speed). Then I got adventurous and started doing this to pass, and think I've gotten pretty good. I can't do a bang-on rev-match every time, but it's good fun to try.

[ClutchFork]

I would just stay in the current gear and right before coming to a full stop put it into 1st then go. DC is the last thing a new stick driver should be attempting IMO, it will be grind city. You guys agree?

If you put it in neutral before/while braking then DCing into 1st is just a matter of staying in neutral and right before coming to a full stop put it into 1st then go. That's why I said DC into 1st at idle.

Hey now. This might be the perfect opportunity to learn DC. If you are coasting in in neutral then your DC is much simpler: in efffect you already are halfway through it, so it will be a simple matter of blip throttle, clutch, and engage. I will definitely try this.

[daleadbull]

I would just stay in the current gear and right before coming to a full stop put it into 1st then go. DC is the last thing a new stick driver should be attempting IMO, it will be grind city. You guys agree?

If you put it in neutral before/while braking then DCing into 1st is just a matter of staying in neutral and right before coming to a full stop put it into 1st then go. That's why I said DC into 1st at idle.

Hey now. This might be the perfect opportunity to learn DC. If you are coasting in in neutral then your DC is much simpler: in efffect you already are halfway through it, so it will be a simple matter of blip throttle, clutch, and engage. I will definitely try this.

But if you are already on the brake, you'll have to do a heel-toe.

I'm going to try DC as well, but I'll probably only do it when trying to get into 1st while rolling. DC any other time would be pointless imo, cus of the synchros on the newer cars. No offence to the LEET manual shifters out there. lol

[theholycow]

But if you are already on the brake, you'll have to do a heel-toe.

No need for that. You wait until your road speed is appropriate to DC into 1st at idle, never touch the accelerator, and your shifter slides right in.

You're making it way too complicated; I wouldn't recommend a complicated DC like you might do at speed. DCing into 1st at idle is exactly the same as not DCing/not even rev-matching into 1st, except you need to be in neutral instead of in gear.

So, OP did this:
1. Cruising at 40mph in 4th gear.
2. Begin braking.
3. Around 20mph, try to shift into 1st.
4. Stop.

Procedure as you describe might be this:
1. Cruising at 40mph in 4th gear.
2. Begin braking.
3. Around 15mph, downshift to another gear.
4. At 2mph shift into 1st.

My procedure is this:
1. Cruising at 40mph in 4th gear.
2. Begin braking.
3. Around 15mph, shift to neutral.
4. At 2mph shift into 1st.

[daleadbull]

My procedure is this:
1. Cruising at 40mph in 4th gear.
2. Begin braking.
3. Around 15mph, shift to neutral.
4. At 2mph shift into 1st.

I do this sometimes too but I guess I didn't consider this as DC.

For example, when I'm pulling into my garage which is at an incline and my car is fairly low so I almost come to a crawl while pulling into the driveway. What I do is, clutch in at the current gear (usually 3rd) then move into 1st while barely moving, then engage and go.

Are you saying, shifting into neutral, let the clutch out, at around 2 mph clutch in and go into 1st. Does this make it smoother?

[theholycow]

Are you saying, shifting into neutral, let the clutch out, at around 2 mph clutch in and go into 1st. Does this make it smoother?

Yes. Replace "2mph" with whatever speed your car does in 1st at idle (or at the same RPM as it idles in neutral, if it idles differently in gear vs. neutral). It's likely to be somewhere in the low single digits of MPH, I just threw 2 out there to demonstrate.

That is a double clutch rev matched downshift to 1st, despite not needing to do anything fancy with any pedals or the shifter. It isn't necessary (unless your 1st is unsynchronized/bad synchro and your clutch doesn't spin down like it should) but it's pleasant.

[rml605]

I do exactly what you do cow, except im pretty I just slip the clutch a little into 1st. I can't rev match into 1st for the life of me.

[theholycow]

Keep trying it at slightly different speeds, you may eventually find the right speed where you can dump the clutch.

[ClutchFork]

Now there is an alternative to double clutching and rev matching. Don't use the clutch at all. Then when you DS, hold the shifter gently but firmly in the gate, rev the engine and when the revs match, voilà--it goes into gear with both syncro speed and engine speed matching road speed. Perhaps we should only use the clutch for launching.

[theholycow]

That could be considered a rudimentary form of double clutching. Indeed, proper clutchless shifting is often described as a type of double clutching (and is done the same way as double clutching except without the clutch pedal, and probably somewhat abuses the synchros even if you're perfect), but just holding it at the gate and revving until it catches...man that's gotta burn up the synchros pretty fiercely.

[ClutchFork]

... but just holding it at the gate and revving until it catches...man that's gotta burn up the synchros pretty fiercely.