New to driving stick

[rml605]

Hey guys, recently bought my first stick car about 2.5 months ago and im doing pretty good with all my shifts, rev matching, EXCEPT the 1-2 shift.

I have a TSX and I think 1st gear is like 3.27 than 2nd is 1.88 so it's a decent drop. I can get the shift pretty smooth when at <3K RPM, but after that it is a disaster lol.

Usually at a redlight i'll just right away to 2nd, but it's when making turns and I end up at like 4K. Should I just shift in turn? Should I keep my foot a little on the gas? I've heard I just need to let the revs drop, but how do I shift quick then?

[RITmusic2k]

The short answer is "Fast or Smooth: Pick one." If you're trying to get the car moving as fast as possible as quickly as possible, such as might be done on a race track, then yes, you should wind out 1st gear all the way up to redline then slam into 2nd as quickly as you can... but in almost every real-world driving scenario, it tends to be best to use 1st gear for launching and then shifting into 2nd as early as possible.

You mentioned that you understand there's a big ratio difference between 1st and 2nd, and the key word here is ratio - the difference in revs between those two gears is not a fixed number - the gap between them gets wider the faster the car is moving. This also means that the slower you're going when you shift, the less the gap between them will be, therefore that shift will be easier to complete. If you're already moving, you should almost never need to shift back down to 1st gear - that's really reserved for launching and parking lot maneuvering... 2nd will be more than capable of getting you around a corner, even if you're taking it really slowly...


EDIT: In rereading your post I realize now that you were asking about a specific case like making a righthand turn from a dead stop or something similar - yeah, if you're not comfortable taking 1st up that high, you can shift into 2nd while you're in the middle of the turn. That's not going to hurt anything. But if you do take the turn all the way in 1st and you end up at 4000rpms, then yes, the only way to continue smoothly is to wait for the revs to fall the appropriate amount before you engage 2nd gear. But I guarantee you you're not slowing down as much or as abruptly as you think you are in this case - you have PLENTY of time to wait for those revs to fall; you won't be causing any traffic jams behind you.

[theholycow]

Shifting during the turn is fine. Keep in mind that if you're pushing the limit of your traction, the shock of shifting (or, similarly, of being in 1st gear at high RPM and not being perfectly smooth on the accelerator) can break your traction and cause a loss of control. On the other hand, if you're driving the way you should drive on public roads then shifting will not cause any problem at all.

Keeping your foot on the gas will help if the problem is that the revs are dropping too fast.

If the opposite, waiting for the revs to drop will help. As you implied, you can't shift quick if you're waiting for the revs to drop. You could slip the clutch to smooth the shift, similar to launching but a bit faster, or you could wait, or you could accept some shift shock. I tend to enjoy a bit of shift shock, it feels nice to me.

[rml605]

Thanks guys.

I think im just lost on how fast to release the clutch. Im just confused on how exactly people shift so smooth from 1st to 2nd yet so quickly. Like if you're racing from a red light, and you red line in 1st, you just have to wait for the revs to drop, no? Or else youll just have bad jerk?


Also one more question...

If im coming to a red light and slowing down to like 5-10 mph and I throw my car in N and suddenly the light changes...should I just throw it in 2nd and release the clutch fast? Or do I have blip the fast before releasing the clutch?

[Shadow]

Thanks guys.

I think im just lost on how fast to release the clutch. Im just confused on how exactly people shift so smooth from 1st to 2nd yet so quickly. Like if you're racing from a red light, and you red line in 1st, you just have to wait for the revs to drop, no? Or else youll just have bad jerk?

I see a lot of new manual trans drivers who focus too much on clutch engagement speed. There is no right or wrong way to do it, as long as you're not releasing it so slowly that you're burning it....and you'd know if you were doing that because it would smell awful. Anyway, just use your own judgment on what you think is the correct speed to engage the clutch.

As for a quick shift from 1st to 2nd, keep in mind you can physically move the shift lever quickly or slowly, just like you can engage the clutch quickly or slowly. You just need to coordinate your hand & feet, which comes with practice.

If you're redlining 1st gear and you want to continue accelerating hard, then you would not wait for the revs to drop. Just shift into 2nd gear quickly and stab/release the clutch. When you're at maximum acceleration, smooth shifts shouldn't be a priority.

Also one more question...

If im coming to a red light and slowing down to like 5-10 mph and I throw my car in N and suddenly the light changes...should I just throw it in 2nd and release the clutch fast? Or do I have blip the fast before releasing the clutch?

Depends where the revs are and the speed that the car is moving at the time you want to start accelerating. If you're at idle (which is usually around 800 rpm), you'll probably want to blip the throttle a bit to bring the revs up to where they'll be when you engage the clutch in 2nd gear. You don't have to get it perfect every time, close is usually good enough. If you don't blip the throttle, the clutch will absorb it, but you'll probably get a little jerk as you release the clutch. And if you just happen to be at the right speed, you might get lucky and have the rpm where it needs to be for a smooth 2nd gear engagement without blipping the throttle.

[rml605]

Thanks!

I think I just have to learn my car more. I also want to try heel/toe. to make turns/corners easier.

[potownrob]

...I have a TSX...

uber jelly

[rml605]

...I have a TSX...

uber jelly

lol yeah, just ot it almost 3 months ago, first stick car!

It's not fast, but it's a VTEC so it's a high revving motor and a very fun car to drive. Great handling and good on gas.

[fr4n]

...I have a TSX...

uber jelly

lol yeah, just ot it almost 3 months ago, first stick car!

It's not fast, but it's a VTEC so it's a high revving motor and a very fun car to drive. Great handling and good on gas.

i wouldn't say the TSX is a very high revving car..

[rml605]

Very high revving? No, but it's a Honda/VTEC which are made to get their most torque at a high RPM.

It's not like I go around town at 5RPM. Occassionally ill get it high before shifting.


And I figured out my problem with the 1-2 shift. I wasn't getting to the gas quick enough. Now im shifting quicker and getting on the gas and it's smooth.

[fr4n]

Very high revving? No, but it's a Honda/VTEC which are made to get their most torque at a high RPM.

It's not like I go around town at 5RPM. Occassionally ill get it high before shifting.


And I figured out my problem with the 1-2 shift. I wasn't getting to the gas quick enough. Now im shifting quicker and getting on the gas and it's smooth.

over 9000 rpm!

[rml605]

Very high revving? No, but it's a Honda/VTEC which are made to get their most torque at a high RPM.

It's not like I go around town at 5RPM. Occassionally ill get it high before shifting.


And I figured out my problem with the 1-2 shift. I wasn't getting to the gas quick enough. Now im shifting quicker and getting on the gas and it's smooth.

over 9000 rpm!

I wish lol.

Car has no torque what so ever unless you get it at 4K+RPM.


Also, heel/toe def. looks easier than it really is. Tried doing it today like an idiot on an open street and ended up missing the gas I almost went through the windshield on downshifting from 5th to 3rd. Def. just trying this around my neighborhood with no one around, I have no idea why I did this lol.

[Squint]

Also, heel/toe def. looks easier than it really is. Tried doing it today like an idiot on an open street and ended up missing the gas I almost went through the windshield on downshifting from 5th to 3rd. Def. just trying this around my neighborhood with no one around, I have no idea why I did this lol.

This is even funnier to me because I started to write out a post saying perhaps you should work on regular problems first before going for something more complicated like heel-toe... and then I didn't.

Perhaps I should have

[rml605]

Also, heel/toe def. looks easier than it really is. Tried doing it today like an idiot on an open street and ended up missing the gas I almost went through the windshield on downshifting from 5th to 3rd. Def. just trying this around my neighborhood with no one around, I have no idea why I did this lol.

This is even funnier to me because I started to write out a post saying perhaps you should work on regular problems first before going for something more complicated like heel-toe... and then I didn't.

Perhaps I should have

lol I have most things down, just need to get quicker at them now. Never stall now so that's good ha.

It's just tough to turn on corners/sharp turns and just do a regular rev match and not holding the brake. Since I don't know heel toe, on really sharp turns i'll just throw it into N and then go in gear or i'll just hold the clutch in through the turn, then release it. Not sure if this is bad or not.

[theholycow]

It's just tough to turn on corners/sharp turns and just do a regular rev match and not holding the brake. Since I don't know heel toe, on really sharp turns i'll just throw it into N and then go in gear or i'll just hold the clutch in through the turn, then release it. Not sure if this is bad or not.

What you're doing is fine. One other option, if you don't like what you're doing and don't want to shift during the turn, is to shift before the turn.