Winter driving tips/techniques

[watkins]

Whoa! Welcome back!

[Hatchman]

LOL Thanks guys. I've been popping in sporadically the last few months. Trying to keep it limited. Forums can be a dangerous place, and I provided lots of proof of that when I hung out here too much.

[Tups]

Got my first taste of winter driving today. Of course there's only a fraction of an inch of snow, but most of the roads are covered with a thin layer of (black) ice and the intersections are becoming quite slippery...

I think I'm going to try that "lifting the gas while cornering" in a parking lot one day once we get a bit more snow and ice. I could take some video as well, once my friend comes back from China with his camera...

[Hatchman]

I think I'm going to try that "lifting the gas while cornering"

What do you mean Tupps? I mean what effect does that have?

[Tups]

What do you mean Tupps? I mean what effect does that have?

I think it was discussed in this or the other winter driving thread. When you lift the gas while cornering, the weight shifts to the front because of sudden engine braking, and the rear tires lose grip.

edit: Oh, and the effect of all this is spinning out. It (probably) happened to me couple of years ago - I spun out in a corner near my parents' house for (then) unknown reason. Apparently I had lifted the gas pedal and, because my car has a carburetor and therefore is very sensitive to sudden changes in throttle, the rear wheels lost grip and I ended up spinning over the other lane to a park.

[Bawked]

remember lifting off the throttle abruptly doesn't mean the back will get loose, you need to get near the traction limit with the rear wheels then use the technique to pass it, with snow and ice the traction limit is much lower though so its easier to get the back sliding.

[mad_finn]

blahblah blaaaah basic idea blahblaah

[Tups]

Well, I was going to just to try it as it might happen on public roads, i.e. more or less unintentionally and accidentally, but thanks to you, well...

[LHOswald]

my truck, because it is carbureted is very sensitive to throttle input changes. must have to do with something about the vacuum the carb creates when the throttle plate is closed. anyway, i can get that ass end out by slowly starting to turn and half way through the turn dump the gas.

[94Corolla5Speed]

It's funny you guys mention lift-off oversteer. I've only been able to achieve lift off oversteer in the dry and going at least 30 mph. If it's anything other than dry, my car just understeers horribly. That includes rain, ice, and snow.

[Bawked]

apparently the 2 snap oversteers and many have crashed their 2s by lifting off and spinning.... so I tried and the back barely goes out at all, even at like 80mph lifting as quick as possible the back just hangs at a little...i'm thinking its because I have 235 width toyo t1r tires on the back instead of stock 185 pizza cutters. Since that didn't work well I decided to try a bigger weight transfer... aka use the brakes mid corner! Holy crap batman, was taking a corner about 60mph off the gas touch the brake, the back swings out so far i'm almost pointing perpendicular to the way i'm going so I mash the throttle again and go full opposite lock and just manage to save it, so yea use the brakes for a bigger weight transfer but you can also induce understeer if you use the brakes too much too early.

[LHOswald]

mr2's weight distribution is extremely nice...until you want to try and get the ass out. that thing is a pain to try and do donuts in. since the engine is in the back its almost impossible to get the rear tires loose, and then next to impossible to get to do a donut. me and my buddy succeeded by going about 50 in 3rd, non-rev match downshifting into 2nd, and then holding the gas and clutch-kicking the shit out of it.

we flew in one direction and did like a 1080.

there was shit in my pants, and the oh shit handle still has grip marks from me

[AHTOXA]

I remember shoveling shit out of my pants when my buddy was doing huuuge power slides in his Camaro last year.

[mad_finn]

I would be... if I would be as passanger in that taxi

[theholycow]

my truck, because it is carbureted is very sensitive to throttle input changes. must have to do with something about the vacuum the carb creates when the throttle plate is closed. anyway, i can get that ass end out by slowly starting to turn and half way through the turn dump the gas.

....it might also have something to do with the fact that it's a PICKUP TRUCK with an empty bed.

Fuel injected vehicles with cable throttle (and obedient DBW) have the same vacuum. Could be a small difference in engine braking from fuel injection's ability to keep the A/F ratio perfect.

It's funny you guys mention lift-off oversteer. I've only been able to achieve lift off oversteer in the dry and going at least 30 mph. If it's anything other than dry, my car just understeers horribly. That includes rain, ice, and snow.

FWD...different animal. RWD lift-off understeer is not only from weigh transfer, but also from engine braking at the rear wheels helping break their traction. With FWD, you not only don't have the rear wheels braking (eliminating the action in question), but you also have the front wheels braking (counteracting it and helping the front wheels lose traction).