Shifting into second as soon as you get rolling

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vw100
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Shifting into second as soon as you get rolling

Postby vw100 » Fri Jul 10, 2015 7:08 am

shifting from 1.5k to 2k (only first to second)
I have found that this way the 1-2 shift is PERFECTLY smooth every time no matter how you release the clutch because the rpm will be at or really close to idle on the 2nd gear (so it is perfectly revmatched) of course after you complete the shift you have to be gentle on the accelerator until you gain some speed before you can really go pedal to the metal, so you don't lug the engine.
What do you guys think ?
I don't have a problem shifting smooth anymore at any given rpm but i taught this to a friend and it worked wonders so i decided to implement it myself. Doing this there is no occasional jerky shift we all get sometimes.
i don't know whether this works on petrols because i have never driven one.

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Re: Shifting into second as soon as you get rolling

Postby theholycow » Fri Jul 10, 2015 12:05 pm

It's what I recommend for everyone except those times that you have some real need to wind out first gear. 1500-2000 is usually higher than necessary to get into second at idle, in my experience.

My car doesn't love it so lately I'm used to taking second all the way up to 2000 or so.
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Re: Shifting into second as soon as you get rolling

Postby Squint » Fri Jul 10, 2015 2:53 pm

My car has an apparently fairly flexible (not mechanically) first gear. I usually stick in first until ~2000 RPM, which puts me close to 10 mph. In fact, most of my shifts are in ~10 mph intervals and that typically keeps the car in the 1700-2200 RPM range (obviously until 5th and higher speeds).

Some cars I've driven REALLY don't like going back into first when moving at all, my Fiesta is fine with it even between 5-10 mph, though if I'm going over 5 mph, I'll usually just go to second. Maybe it's just user friendly...?
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Re: Shifting into second as soon as you get rolling

Postby vw100 » Fri Jul 10, 2015 5:03 pm

theholycow wrote:It's what I recommend for everyone except those times that you have some real need to wind out first gear. 1500-2000 is usually higher than necessary to get into second at idle, in my experience.

My car doesn't love it so lately I'm used to taking second all the way up to 2000 or so.

my 6 speed vw does 4000rpm - 38km/h in first
4000rpm-70km/h in second gear and idles just a hair above 800rpm so i believe lower than 1500 it will bang and stall. Anyway i still pause the foot just a tiny bit but the the thing is it is PERFECTLY smooth just like clutching out in neutral.
Why doesn't your car like it ? does it lug ? because theoricaly it should work with every car. I don't know if petrols have the torque to do it

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Re: Shifting into second as soon as you get rolling

Postby vw100 » Fri Jul 10, 2015 5:15 pm

Squint wrote:My car has an apparently fairly flexible (not mechanically) first gear. I usually stick in first until ~2000 RPM, which puts me close to 10 mph. In fact, most of my shifts are in ~10 mph intervals and that typically keeps the car in the 1700-2200 RPM range (obviously until 5th and higher speeds).

Some cars I've driven REALLY don't like going back into first when moving at all, my Fiesta is fine with it even between 5-10 mph, though if I'm going over 5 mph, I'll usually just go to second. Maybe it's just user friendly...?

mine does 38km/h at 4000rpm in first. I keep the car as close to 2000 rpm as i can. The guys at tdiclub have some gold rules. They advice to shift at no less than 3000 rpm everytime. I do that when i can. But i can't really do that in first because mostly it will jerk a bit. Going into 3rd and 4th i hit 4k easly. I would like to do what they say even when going into 2nd but i just don't like the jerkiness. They do it because they are that experienced. Years and years of driving and working on their cars. RESPECT for them :wink:
ps: i can get it into first without resistance under 15km/h (that's the highest i have tried, maybe it can do more)

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Re: Shifting into second as soon as you get rolling

Postby theholycow » Fri Jul 10, 2015 11:31 pm

vw100 wrote:Why doesn't your car like it ? does it lug ? because theoricaly it should work with every car. I don't know if petrols have the torque to do it

Stupid carburetor, ancient ignition system design, deferred maintenance, repairs needed, and the transmission is starting to act like it's had a long hard life...which is exactly what it has had. If I hadn't gotten exponentially more lazy in the past two years it would be in better shape and I could shift out of 1st at 1000RPM or so. As it stands I have to be gentle on everything and there's no power anywhere. Well, driving it like that beats actually getting my ass out in the yard and fixing it, right? :wink:
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Re: Shifting into second as soon as you get rolling

Postby Squint » Mon Jul 13, 2015 12:21 pm

vw100 wrote:mine does 38km/h at 4000rpm in first. I keep the car as close to 2000 rpm as i can. The guys at tdiclub have some gold rules. They advice to shift at no less than 3000 rpm everytime. I do that when i can. But i can't really do that in first because mostly it will jerk a bit. Going into 3rd and 4th i hit 4k easly. I would like to do what they say even when going into 2nd but i just don't like the jerkiness. They do it because they are that experienced. Years and years of driving and working on their cars. RESPECT for them :wink:
ps: i can get it into first without resistance under 15km/h (that's the highest i have tried, maybe it can do more)

Why do they advise not shifting before 3000 RPM? The power band on a diesel is wider (and typically lower) than on a gas engine, so you should have no issues at all shifting lower than that. I'm curious as to their reasoning.
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Re: Shifting into second as soon as you get rolling

Postby IMBoring25 » Mon Jul 13, 2015 10:39 pm

Sounds like they just want to go fast and make noise and they're coming up with arguments to support their desires to me...

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Re: Shifting into second as soon as you get rolling

Postby vw100 » Thu Jul 16, 2015 5:23 pm

The reason for this is to keep the turbo on boost, clear the VNT guide vanes and apply firm pressure to the rings for optimal sealing against blow-by gasses. The rings need the boost to seal since its a turbo charged engine, babying the engine is detrimental and will lead to issues with compression if done so for very long.
-Keep rpms as close to 2000 rpm as possible when driving at a steady speed. This promotes optimum temperatures for the DPF and keeps the engine in the middle of its most efficient rpm range (1800-2200 rpm).
This is what they say

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Re: Shifting into second as soon as you get rolling

Postby tankinbeans » Thu Jul 23, 2015 11:10 pm

I have no problem winding first out and getting pretty smooth. All I do is go as high as I feel, take both feet of the pedals to let the car settle and begin its minor engine braking, clutch in and hop into second.

I have no interest in dropping out our the torque curve so I can accelerate slowly.
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Re: Shifting into second as soon as you get rolling

Postby Rope-Pusher » Fri Sep 18, 2015 6:20 pm

Speakin' of Diesels,....

VW accused of using software in 482,000 diesels to skirt U.S. clean-air rules


WASHINGTON -- Volkswagen and Audi sold about 482,000 diesel vehicles with illegal emissions control software designed to make their cars appear cleaner in testing than they are in the real world, the EPA said today.

The software, included on VW and Audi vehicles from the 2009-15 model years with 2.0-liter turbodiesel engines, detects when a car is undergoing EPA emissions testing and turns on the vehicle’s full emissions controls. The software then switched off the full emissions controls during real-world driving, the EPA said in a statement.

Under federal law, the EPA can levy a maximum possible fine of $37,500 per vehicle, EPA officials said on a conference call with reporters today, meaning VW and Audi face potential fines of up to $18 billion for the alleged violations.

http://www.autonews.com/article/2015091 ... news-blast
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Re: Shifting into second as soon as you get rolling

Postby Squint » Mon Sep 21, 2015 11:41 am

I saw that article on Friday when it made the news, RP. You have to feel this is one of those things that the EPA should come after as hard as possible to set an example. If they let them off with a relative slap on the wrist, then other companies could just decide to make their cars only clean for inspections too...
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Re: Shifting into second as soon as you get rolling

Postby Rope-Pusher » Mon Sep 21, 2015 12:30 pm

I heard VW stock share price has dropt with this noose.

So,....who else have they been duping? How about the models they sell in the Eurozone
Image
....are they clean?
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Re: Shifting into second as soon as you get rolling

Postby AHTOXA » Mon Sep 21, 2015 3:29 pm

theholycow wrote:It's what I recommend for everyone except those times that you have some real need to wind out first gear. 1500-2000 is usually higher than necessary to get into second at idle, in my experience.

My car doesn't love it so lately I'm used to taking second all the way up to 2000 or so.


Putting this thread back on topic.

Shifting is entirely depending on how you like to drive. In normal street driving (not offroad with a low ration transfer case, for example), I never shift that low. Typically, I shift out of 1st around 2500 or 3000 RPM. My style of driving is to come up to speed briskly using the first 3 gears, after that I just about always skip either 3-5-6 and maybe 3-4-6.
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Re: Shifting into second as soon as you get rolling

Postby tankinbeans » Mon Sep 21, 2015 3:40 pm

IMBoring25 wrote:Sounds like they just want to go fast and make noise and they're coming up with arguments to support their desires to me...

Is there anything to the assertion made by VW100 regarding keeping on the boost for seal health? Does that only apply to diesels or should I be making a point to boost more often with my petrol engine? I go into overboost a couple times a day while bringing up to 20 regularly enough.
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