hockeystyx16 wrote:there you go, your getting the point.
manual steering is easy on 205 pizza cutters, its hard 2 handed work on 245s. and this steering rack isnt leaking, you know what they say. if it aint broke dont fix it.
I just remember a day when my powersteering pump fried on my Xterra while out wheelin'. I drove the truck home with no powersteering for 65 miles. That was done on 12.5" (305 width equivalent) mud tires.
I wanna see you parallel park that sucker with no power steering.
wannabe wrote:
well, the dudes name is orly...so it DOES tie in, ur just not awake enough
FAIL!
Indeed.
Edit: I realized I just posted something that didn't contribute anything towards the topic at hand.
Welcome to the forum, orly.
Bottom line: Buy a standard and be happy! Get the BMW and learn from it. Take it easy.
Last edited by padauk_dust on Wed May 28, 2008 7:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Buy the bmw, you'll learn to drive it in a month tops, and then you'll be having the time of your life! AND, you wont break anything. seriously, driving stick is not that hard. it will be tough at frist, but somtimes i think ppl on this site take it WAY too far. This isnt rocket science... actually BUYING another car just to learn on it... give me a break. If you factor in buying a beater, the time it takes to buy it, and then insure it, and then sell it again...
Also, dont forget the BMW is a high performance car, it's meant to be beat the f@ck out of, it was designed to be reinforced to take abuse, so a new driver shouldnt be hard for it to handle. Just get the BMW you wont regret it
I don't think that the BMW will be too hard to learn on. Learning to handle that much power could be a problem and could be dangerous, as it can cause you to spin out if you are off too much on you control inputs. But the real reason I don't think it is such a good idea to learn on a powerful car is not that it is too hard, but that it is too easy. The car has so much torque that you can be way off on you gear selection and shift points and the car will still go. It is with a lower powered car that you really have to learn to manage your gears properly. There are lessons that 80hp will teach that you may never learn with 300hp.
To put it another way, to reach the performance limits of a BMW, you need to go the the Nurburgring. To reach the performance limits of a 10 year old civic, you only need to drive to the grocery store. I note that one of the first things people tell you about motocross is that you should perfect you driving before you modify your car. You only learn about limits and how to handle them when you have the opportunity to reach them. Driving a limited car puts you in a position to learn to handle those limits. That's a valuable lesson to learn before you start trying to push a higher-powered car to its limits (supposing you can find a safe and legal place to do so).
Fair enough, but i still think its rediculous to buy a car to learn on and then buy the car he wants. If he is responsible and smart enough to know he cant push the car to its limits untill he improves his skill, he'll be fine. And if for what ever reason he decided to get a lower hp car after, then he'll learn the in's and out's when he gets there. i have a 1987 mazda 323 with 89 raging horsepower that i bought 3 years AFTER i bought my z. i can drive it just fine. if you know how to drive stick and manage rpm on a high performance car, you know how to do it on a low hp car. The diffrence is recognition of circumstances and adjusting your driving style accordingly. Is it overall better to get a lower hp car to learn on? Probably, im not arguing that. Telling him to get a different car to learn on, and then get the car he's asking about now? get real.
I agree with paolo, its ridiculous to buy a car just to learn on, then buy another car.
I have friends who claim they want to get a manual but don't want to buy a new car and "mess it up." I can't convince them that this is quite rediculous. If anything its slightly easier to learn on a new car b/c its probably less likely stuff will break.
prodigal, I don't come near the limits of my 12 year old civic driving to the grocery store, but I see your point.
ra64t wrote:I
I have friends who claim they want to get a manual but don't want to buy a new car and "mess it up." I can't convince them that this is quite rediculous. If anything its slightly easier to learn on a new car b/c its probably less likely stuff will break.
That depends. I have two friends who had to replace the clutch when learning on a new car. However, they did not have any outside help or instruction on what to do or not to do. That may have played a role.
So seeing that I see where you friends are coming from. It can also be harder to learn on a new car because new clutch is a lot grabbier than a worn in clutch with a few tens of thousands on it. There's more room for error on a used clutch.
ra64t wrote:I
I have friends who claim they want to get a manual but don't want to buy a new car and "mess it up." I can't convince them that this is quite rediculous. If anything its slightly easier to learn on a new car b/c its probably less likely stuff will break.
That depends. I have two friends who had to replace the clutch when learning on a new car. However, they did not have any outside help or instruction on what to do or not to do. That may have played a role.
So seeing that I see where you friends are coming from. It can also be harder to learn on a new car because new clutch is a lot grabbier than a worn in clutch with a few tens of thousands on it. There's more room for error on a used clutch.
If I had learned on a brand new clutch, I would've had problems. Mine could take the stress, and I can DD my car and still baby the clutch to the point where I'm not even remotely worried about it.
ra64t wrote:I
I have friends who claim they want to get a manual but don't want to buy a new car and "mess it up." I can't convince them that this is quite rediculous. If anything its slightly easier to learn on a new car b/c its probably less likely stuff will break.
That depends. I have two friends who had to replace the clutch when learning on a new car. However, they did not have any outside help or instruction on what to do or not to do. That may have played a role.
So seeing that I see where you friends are coming from. It can also be harder to learn on a new car because new clutch is a lot grabbier than a worn in clutch with a few tens of thousands on it. There's more room for error on a used clutch.
I see what you mean about the grabbier clutch, but if they burn out a new clutch that quick, I assume they'll burn out an old faster since it'll already be half or more worn. Also I don't think its really cheaper to replace the clutch on an old car vs. new.
ra64t wrote:I
I have friends who claim they want to get a manual but don't want to buy a new car and "mess it up." I can't convince them that this is quite rediculous. If anything its slightly easier to learn on a new car b/c its probably less likely stuff will break.
That depends. I have two friends who had to replace the clutch when learning on a new car. However, they did not have any outside help or instruction on what to do or not to do. That may have played a role.
So seeing that I see where you friends are coming from. It can also be harder to learn on a new car because new clutch is a lot grabbier than a worn in clutch with a few tens of thousands on it. There's more room for error on a used clutch.
I see what you mean about the grabbier clutch, but if they burn out a new clutch that quick, I assume they'll burn out an old faster since it'll already be half or more worn. Also I don't think its really cheaper to replace the clutch on an old car vs. new.
I can tell you this much right now. It's a helluva lot cheaper to replace a clutch on a little four banger than it's gonna be on a BMW. Parts for bimmers aren't cheap.
Not necessaraly. If doing yourself, then you are correct but if taking to a shop the Bimmer might be cheaper. It's almost always less labor to replace the tranny/clutch on a RWD rather than a FWD.
for fvck sakes... i try not to be like this, but sh!t i get frustrated with ppl some times... ITS A FVCKING CAR! DRIVE IT! YOU WONT BREAK IT, AND IF YOU DO, FIX IT! BUY THE DAMN THING, DO YOUR BEST AND HAVE FUN ALONG THE WAY!
Indeed.