2012 BMW 328i
2012 BMW 328i
A friend of mine picked up a new 2012 328i (stick shift, thankfully!) a while back and I finally got a chance to drive it. For those who might not know, the new 328i now comes with a 2.0 turbo engine, just like my A5. This seems to be a trend now, with lots of smaller displacement turbocharged engines replacing naturally aspirated sixes.
Anyway, I was simply amazed at how similar this BMW feels compared to my Audi. It really feels almost identical in the way that it responds to throttle input. Like my A5, the BMW makes plenty of low-end torque, so it pulls away effortlessly from a stop. The turbo spools up quickly with almost no turbo lag. And it also has plenty of passing power on the highway while in 6th gear. There is no rev hang whatsoever, just like my car. The only thing that feels a little bit different is the clutch. Not so much the amount of effort or the engagement point, but more in the way that it almost "eases" into the next gear. I think that might just be due to the infamous CDV (clutch delay valve) that seems to be found on just about every BMW under the sun. It's not bad, but it does take some getting used to. If I owned the car, I'd probably just rip the CDV out. As far as the engine & transmission are concerned, I really have to wonder if BMW targeted Audi's 2.0T because it just feels so unbelievably similar. One thing that I didn't like about the BMW is that the engine ticks fairly loud at idle. Sounds like the fuel injectors ticking, but it's much less noticeable in my Audi.
The other thing that really stuck out about the BMW is the steering. It is electric now, and it definitely feels like they turned it more for luxury than sport. It's too light (reminds me of an old Buick) and can be turned with your pinky. I guess owner will adapt to it, but I prefer a heavier steering wheel with a better feel (especially on-center) and response.
Overall, I really liked the car. I think they did a great job with the drivetrain. I'd take the new engine over the old straight six any day, just because of the extra low-end torque alone. And I don't think the new engine gives up very much in the way of smoothness either. Don't get me wrong, BMW's straight six is an unbelievable engine (I had one in my old M3), but the new turbo four is apparently very well balanced and smooth.
Anyway, I was simply amazed at how similar this BMW feels compared to my Audi. It really feels almost identical in the way that it responds to throttle input. Like my A5, the BMW makes plenty of low-end torque, so it pulls away effortlessly from a stop. The turbo spools up quickly with almost no turbo lag. And it also has plenty of passing power on the highway while in 6th gear. There is no rev hang whatsoever, just like my car. The only thing that feels a little bit different is the clutch. Not so much the amount of effort or the engagement point, but more in the way that it almost "eases" into the next gear. I think that might just be due to the infamous CDV (clutch delay valve) that seems to be found on just about every BMW under the sun. It's not bad, but it does take some getting used to. If I owned the car, I'd probably just rip the CDV out. As far as the engine & transmission are concerned, I really have to wonder if BMW targeted Audi's 2.0T because it just feels so unbelievably similar. One thing that I didn't like about the BMW is that the engine ticks fairly loud at idle. Sounds like the fuel injectors ticking, but it's much less noticeable in my Audi.
The other thing that really stuck out about the BMW is the steering. It is electric now, and it definitely feels like they turned it more for luxury than sport. It's too light (reminds me of an old Buick) and can be turned with your pinky. I guess owner will adapt to it, but I prefer a heavier steering wheel with a better feel (especially on-center) and response.
Overall, I really liked the car. I think they did a great job with the drivetrain. I'd take the new engine over the old straight six any day, just because of the extra low-end torque alone. And I don't think the new engine gives up very much in the way of smoothness either. Don't get me wrong, BMW's straight six is an unbelievable engine (I had one in my old M3), but the new turbo four is apparently very well balanced and smooth.
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Re: 2012 BMW 328i
Do you notice a difference with and without a CDV. I heard that the difference is negligible.
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Re: 2012 BMW 328i
Dumb question, but why would all the Beemer owners take it out if it made no difference? Having never driven one, I have no clue how much of a difference it makes, but that was my first reaction. (not trying to be offensive)bk7794 wrote:Do you notice a difference with and without a CDV. I heard that the difference is negligible.
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Re: 2012 BMW 328i
The only BMW I've ever owned was my E36 M3. I don't believe that generation had a CDV.bk7794 wrote:Do you notice a difference with and without a CDV. I heard that the difference is negligible.
From what I understand, removing the CDV makes the clutch feel a lot better because it removes the delay. Think of it sorta like rev hang---it's better when there isn't any.
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Re: 2012 BMW 328i
Well I thought it was all based on personal preference as well. I don't know I thought I saw something about that haha.Squint wrote:Dumb question, but why would all the Beemer owners take it out if it made no difference? Having never driven one, I have no clue how much of a difference it makes, but that was my first reaction. (not trying to be offensive)bk7794 wrote:Do you notice a difference with and without a CDV. I heard that the difference is negligible.
Shadow wrote:The only BMW I've ever owned was my E36 M3. I don't believe that generation had a CDV.bk7794 wrote:Do you notice a difference with and without a CDV. I heard that the difference is negligible.
From what I understand, removing the CDV makes the clutch feel a lot better because it removes the delay. Think of it sorta like rev hang---it's better when there isn't any.
Thats how I thought of it haha.six wrote:Clutch-hang hahaha
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Re: 2012 BMW 328i
That's actually not too far off if you think about it. The delay valve kind of softens an abrupt application of the clutch by not allowing it to shock the drivetrain. So you can say it sort of "hangs" the clutch...hence, clutch-hang.six wrote:Clutch-hang hahaha
LOL
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Re: 2012 BMW 328i
What are you clutching that's hanging.six wrote:Clutch-hang hahaha
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Re: 2012 BMW 328i
I don't know if my friend's VW has a CDV, but I know my car does. His car is definitely easier for a relative noob to drive than my car.bk7794 wrote:Do you notice a difference with and without a CDV. I heard that the difference is negligible.
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Re: 2012 BMW 328i
Really? I would have thought the CDV was because it helped eliminate a quick release or a dump the clutch scenario.tankinbeans wrote:I don't know if my friend's VW has a CDV, but I know my car does. His car is definitely easier for a relative noob to drive than my car.bk7794 wrote:Do you notice a difference with and without a CDV. I heard that the difference is negligible.
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Re: 2012 BMW 328i
What it does when you dump the clutch is force your clutch to slip a lot more than normal, as far as I understand. The way I understand it to work is that there's a nipple or valve in the slave cylinder that restricts fluid from moving too quickly to the other side thereby delaying full engagement. If you're driving sanely and not trying to show off it just messes with your shift.bk7794 wrote:Really? I would have thought the CDV was because it helped eliminate a quick release or a dump the clutch scenario.tankinbeans wrote:I don't know if my friend's VW has a CDV, but I know my car does. His car is definitely easier for a relative noob to drive than my car.bk7794 wrote:Do you notice a difference with and without a CDV. I heard that the difference is negligible.
Re: 2012 BMW 328i
If the first (and only) manual transmission car you've ever driven has a CDV, it probably wouldn't bother you because it would seem normal. But once you've experienced a few manual transmissions without a CDV, chances are good that you wouldn't really appreciate the CDV at all. Then again, under "normal" driving situations, the CDV might not be too obvious. But once you start really driving the car, the CDV is annoying because the clutch doesn't respond the way it would without a delay valve.bk7794 wrote:What it does when you dump the clutch is force your clutch to slip a lot more than normal, as far as I understand. The way I understand it to work is that there's a nipple or valve in the slave cylinder that restricts fluid from moving too quickly to the other side thereby delaying full engagement. If you're driving sanely and not trying to show off it just messes with your shift.tankinbeans wrote:Really? I would have thought the CDV was because it helped eliminate a quick release or a dump the clutch scenario.bk7794 wrote:
I don't know if my friend's VW has a CDV, but I know my car does. His car is definitely easier for a relative noob to drive than my car.
That said, I do think the CDV does help to protect the clutch and the drivetrain of the car when it comes to abusive drivers who dump the clutch a lot.
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Re: 2012 BMW 328i
If the first (and only) manual transmission car you've ever driven has a CDV, it probably wouldn't bother you because it would seem normal. But once you've experienced a few manual transmissions without a CDV, chances are good that you wouldn't really appreciate the CDV at all. Then again, under "normal" driving situations, the CDV might not be too obvious. But once you start really driving the car, the CDV is annoying because the clutch doesn't respond the way it would without a delay valve.Shadow wrote:
What it does when you dump the clutch is force your clutch to slip a lot more than normal, as far as I understand. The way I understand it to work is that there's a nipple or valve in the slave cylinder that restricts fluid from moving too quickly to the other side thereby delaying full engagement. If you're driving sanely and not trying to show off it just messes with your shift.
That said, I do think the CDV does help to protect the clutch and the drivetrain of the car when it comes to abusive drivers who dump the clutch a lot.[/quote]
But sometimes you need to get going, wouldn't that just abuse the clutch more then if it didn't have a CDV?
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Re: 2012 BMW 328i
If you're an experienced driver, it's no problem taking off fast without abusing the clutch.bk7794 wrote: But sometimes you need to get going, wouldn't that just abuse the clutch more then if it didn't have a CDV?
Clutches are made to slip. The CDV may even make them slip more than they would have otherwise during quick engagement. So I guess an argument could be made that a CDV may even cause a bit more wear on the friction surface of the clutch because of the increased slipping as the CDV slows the engagement. But don't get me wrong--it's no big deal either way.
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Re: 2012 BMW 328i
The additional slippage caused by the CDV, in normal everyday driving, is negligible at worst.